Communication to get call straight

[kbilla]

To take this to an extreme, if you had a 7 footer you could camp him under the basket and tell him every time a shot goes up jump up and push the backboard with both hands....other than the risk you run of getting him tech'd for an unsporting act I suppose which would be specious...

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by kbilla

So if you jump up and don't slap, but push the backboard and cause it to shake and the ball falls out, you don't have basket interference?

The wording from Rule 10-3-5-b says, "Intentionally slapping or striking the backboard or causing the ring to vibrate while a try or tap is in flight or is touching the backboard or is in the basket or in the cylinder above the basket." So I think whether they slap, strike, push, or whatever, it's a T.

There is no provision in the rulebook for you to call BI in this situation.

Look up rule 4-6 for a definition of Basket Interference, and as you read it, keep in mind that the backboard is not considered to be part of the basket.

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Certainly - the other important thing to know is that if a player goes up to block a shot and in the process unintentionally slaps the board hard enough to cause the ring to vibrate and the shot to be missed, there is still no call at all.

That would stand to reason...I know that unintentionally slapping the board is not a tech, but before today I would have had BI....thanks again...

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Whistles & Stripes

The wording from Rule 10-3-5-b says, "Intentionally slapping or striking the backboard or causing the ring to vibrate while a try or tap is in flight or is touching the backboard or is in the basket or in the cylinder above the basket." So I think whether they slap, strike, push, or whatever, it's a T.

There is no provision in the rulebook for you to call BI in this situation.

Look up rule 4-6 for a definition of Basket Interference, and as you read it, keep in mind that the backboard is not considered to be part of the basket.

There goes my 7-footer example...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by kbilla

So if you jump up and don't slap, but push the backboard and cause it to shake and the ball falls out, you don't have basket interference? I am not saying I'm calling it for the act of slapping itself, but when you slap the backboard, generally it shakes, if the ball comes out how can you not call BI?

Causing the backboard to shake is only a T and is only a T when it is done without trying to purposely block the shot.

You need to refer to the BI and GT rules in Rule 9 and even the Technical Foul provisions in Rule 10. No where will you see this is GT or BI in any way. And as stated after your post, it was unclear if the ball went in. The basket should only count if there was a T called and the ball went in the hoop. You cannot count the basketball because of this.

Peace

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by kbilla

To take this to an extreme, if you had a 7 footer you could camp him under the basket and tell him every time a shot goes up jump up and push the backboard with both hands....other than the risk you run of getting him tech'd for an unsporting act I suppose which would be specious...

If someone jumps up and "pushes" the backboard with both hands, he's only going to get to do that twice before he's disqualified in my game.

And if it's an actual blocking motion and a slap instead, but it happens on every shot, he's only going to get to do it one or two more times before I determine it's intentional...

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Who is the Referee? If you are the Referee you could change the call or make the proper call if you are in that position. Otherwise all you can do give the proper information and if he does not change it there is not much you can do at the moment. This is one of the rare moments where being the Referee really matters.



I do not know if I would say anything other than, "Ask the official when he comes in front of you."

Peace

I disagree with this assessment. Just because you are the Referee, and not U1 or U2 does not give you the authority to "overrule" your partner. Rule 2-6 states, "No official has the authority to set aside or question decisions made by the other official(s) within the limits of their respective outlined duties."

I think that the best thing to do in a situation such as this is to talk to your partner and ask him why he called what he did. Then, if you believe he interpreted something incorrectly, let him know, and explain why. Then give him the opportunity to change his own call.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by kbilla

Actually I'm not completely clear on the original post, did the ball come out or go through?

Did not go in.

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Did not go in.

Well I learned something new today. Like I said I don't like it, but that doesn't matter much!

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Who is the Referee? If you are the Referee you could change the call or make the proper call if you are in that position.

He was actually the referee.

2-6: No official has the authority to set aside or question decisions made by the other official within the limits of their respective duties.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by kbilla

I don't have my rulebook with me, what does the BI provision say in regard to causing the basket to move? Again I am not talking about the act of slapping itself, agreed that is not BI.

Nothing, except article 4:
Pulls down a movable ring so that it contacts the ball before the ring returns to its original position.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Whistles & Stripes

I disagree with this assessment. Just because you are the Referee, and not U1 or U2 does not give you the authority to "overrule" your partner. Rule 2-6 states, "No official has the authority to set aside or question decisions made by the other official(s) within the limits of their respective outlined duties."

I think that the best thing to do in a situation such as this is to talk to your partner and ask him why he called what he did. Then, if you believe he interpreted something incorrectly, let him know, and explain why. Then give him the opportunity to change his own call.

Rut is refering to 2-5-3, Referee's duties during the game: "Decide whether a goal should count if the officials disagree."

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Rut is refering to 2-5-3, Referee's duties during the game: "Decide whether a goal should count if the officials disagree."

I am glad I read down and you referenced the exact rule I was referring to.

Peace

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Nothing, except article 4:
Pulls down a movable ring so that it contacts the ball before the ring returns to its original position.

Do you see what I mean though about this being fundamentally unfair? If the ball happened to go in you would count it and still assess the T. Yet the reason it didn't go in (at least potentially) is b/c the act that brought the T caused it not to...I don't see the reasoning behind excluding the backboard from this provision, until they make rings that are detached from backboards and floating on their own, if you move the backboard you also move the ring! I would hope this would be addressed at some point, but I suppose there are bigger things...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by kbilla

Do you see what I mean though about this being fundamentally unfair? If the ball happened to go in you would count it and still assess the T. Yet the reason it didn't go in (at least potentially) is b/c the act that brought the T caused it not to...I don't see the reasoning behind excluding the backboard from this provision, until they make rings that are detached from backboards and floating on their own, if you move the backboard you also move the ring! I would hope this would be addressed at some point, but I suppose there are bigger things...

I do not see why this is unfair. The rules just exclude the backboard. I guess they feel the backboard is not an initial part of making the basket. And honestly, I have never seen a ball not go in just because a backboard has been hit or shaken. Then again the issue is not always about fair, the issue is what the rules say. And if this was such a growing problem then maybe the rule would change. I do not think they have seen this as a major issue.

Peace