How big is the coaching box?

[Mark Padgett]

Apparently pretty big in the ACC.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDQE3p4pxYc

[cropduster]

Depends on who the coach is and who is calling the game.
barryb

[JRutledge]

To be fair, the officials are not watching the coach, they are watching the players. The minute the players do something everyone would complain the officials are not doing their job.

Peace

[zebraman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

To be fair, the officials are not watching the coach, they are watching the players. The minute the players do something everyone would complain the officials are not doing their job.

Peace

That excuse didn't work in the two-person system and it certainly doesn't work with three officials.

We can't pick and choose which parts of the game we want to manage. The bench area has to be managed.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zebraman

That excuse didn't work in the two-person system and it certainly doesn't work with three officials.

We can't pick and choose which parts of the game we want to manage. The bench area has to be managed.

I am not making an excuse. In that play, I would not be watching the coach. I probably would not even know where the coach was as the Trail or even lead because you are watching players. The court is the priority, not the coach’s box. And that is why my state backed off the following year after they made a big deal the year before with the coaching box. And it is very clear the person that created the tape is not someone that understands officiating.

Peace

[Mark Padgett]

Rut - I understand your comment, but she is not just a little ways out onto the court, she is waaaaaay out there. I can't see how any of the officials didn't see that.

[JRutledge]

Most of the play was on the other side of the court. For a moment the trail official had the ball close to them and I know then I would not have turned my head to watch what a coach was doing. Then soon after the coach got right back near the sideline and I am not sure the official even were aware of where she was standing. And I seriously doubt any official would be calling a T for just that action.

Peace

[rainmaker]

Mark, yea, she's way out on the floor. But I also think the announcer is making way, way too big a deal out of it. And I don't think no refs saw it. I think they just didn't do anything. There's no way that trail at the very beginning didn't see that coach. In HS, I would definitely call that or at least say something really, really firm, but this isn't HS ball, and I'll let them decide what works for them.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

Mark, yea, she's way out on the floor. But I also think the announcer is making way, way too big a deal out of it. And I don't think no refs saw it. I think they just didn't do anything. There's no way that trail at the very beginning didn't see that coach. In HS, I would definitely call that or at least say something really, really firm, but this isn't HS ball, and I'll let them decide what works for them.

A double negative. So you really think the refs DID see it.

[zebraman]

As far out onto the floor as that coach was (for quite some time), I do not see how someone in the crew did not notice. Officials don't have tunnel vision. The only explanation I can think of is that the crew knew they had just blown a call and were going to let her vent a little. That wouldn't be a good excuse, but it's the only thing I can come up with.

I bet the observers had a lot to say in the locker room. That is just terrible bench management.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zebraman

As far out onto the floor as that coach was (for quite some time), I do not see how someone in the crew did not notice. Officials don't have tunnel vision. The only explanation I can think of is that the crew knew they had just blown a call and were going to let her vent a little. That wouldn't be a good excuse, but it's the only thing I can come up with.

I bet the observers had a lot to say in the locker room. That is just terrible bench management.

The coach might have been clearly out of the box for about 5 seconds at most. About half of that time there was a double team near the Trail official. The Trail official had 3 players right in front of him/her (sorry I cannot tell). Then the ball clearly goes to the other side of the court or near the paint (which we cannot see). As the ball goes away from camera view, the coach is at best on the edge of the coaching box but that is not very clear because the camera angle does not show how far based on the bench is blocking the line. Then as the ball is on the other side of the court, the ball starts going in transition to the other end of the court and the ball is opposite the table.

Now the best official that would have been able to tell is the Trail official mainly because they are on that side. If you know anything about Women's mechanics, they rotate anytime the ball is on the opposite part of the court. It is possible the Lead official made a rotation (we cannot tell on the tape) during the sequence.

Now this tape was only 25 seconds long where 2 transitions are taking place and we are talking seriously about bad management of a coach all during live ball play? Are we serious?

If this situation took place during a HS game and we are using a 14 foot box, not only would we have to know if a coach was on the court, but their depth in that box. So a coach could be completely out of box and we expect officials during live action to know all the coach's whereabouts?

I work pretty much only 3 Person in all my games and I can tell you I hardly ever know where a coach is standing during a live ball unless the ball is right in front of the bench. Now if this was during a dead ball I would understand the reaction. But during live ball in a very short period of time, not that is a little silly if you ask me.

Peace

[Stat-Man]

In 2001, my college alumni were invited to fill in at a college summer league. For some of the games, I kinda assumed the rolse as coach, since it was obvious i wouldn't play much.

In one game, I'm coaching, and wouldn't you know it, the other's team coach comes down and starts coaching in my coaching box.

He did this a couple of more times, so I figured I may as well join the fun and coach from his box. When I do this, the one referee (who was the host school's head coach) tells me to get back into my box. I let him know at the next dead ball that if we were going to enforce the technical points of the rules in a summer game, he needed to tell the other coach to stop tap dancing his way down to my box. Referee told the coach something, and I got a dirty look from said coach, but i just looked at him and shrugged my shoulders, as if to say "What did you expect me to do?"

[zebraman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I work pretty much only 3 Person in all my games and I can tell you I hardly ever know where a coach is standing during a live ball unless the ball is right in front of the bench. Now if this was during a dead ball I would understand the reaction. But during live ball in a very short period of time, not that is a little silly if you ask me.

Peace

Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one Rut. Maybe my state and my college assignors have a different viewpoint on the coaching box than yours do. All I do in my HS and college games is 3-person. The trail had to see the coach on the floor. She was right in front of him as he was coming up the floor. The lead might not have seen the coach if they were turned and watching off-ball, but I would think that the C would have noticed even if they were staying in their area and being aware of where the ball was.

I'm going to assume that the trail didn't think he had time to address the situation during that play and addressed the coach a short time later. I would really like to think that happened. If nobody addressed it then, I'd hate to see how far the coach got out on the floor later in the game.

In our state, coach management is a pretty big emphasis even at the HS level. Allowing a coach to be that far out on the floor without being noticed would definitely be a reason for a crew to not advance to the semi-final round at the state tournament.

And of course there is the recent 2007-08 POI for men's NCAA regarding the coaching box.

[mick]

Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap

A double negative. So you really think the refs DID see it.

That's exactly what rainmaker said ! She thinks someone ignored it.