Did anyone see the end of the A&M vs Texas game tonight.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by TRef21

Cmon easy guys. Lets all be professionals in here. I do have admit I did enjoy reading the arguments. Whether it was intentional or not, fans can complain all they want. It's up to the conference supervisor to take action. I have to say that I really doubt that they will listen to the fans since they don't have a safe in this profession at all levels

Tommy,

I really hesitate to jump in here because I don't want to openly disagree with you twice in one night. I've got no beef with you and I'm really not trying to get in your face. In fact I used to feel exactly the same way you do. I bristled at the way such people were treated here by people I otherwise respected. I was astonished and embarassed at their behavior. It seemed unfair, unfriendly, and unprovoked.

Then I lived through a few years of the annual parade of trolls during the playoffs and March Madness. In the next month they will come out of the woodwork and infest our board. They don't want rational explanations. They are in no mind to be fair, even-handed, or to learn. They are here only to gripe about how, in their completely biased opinion, their team was unfairly treated. Disagreeing with them, no matter how well-intentioned or -deserved, only invites their vitriol and venom.

I have finally come to agree with others that the best policy is to get rid of them as quickly as possible. There are thousands of places such trolls can go to whine. This is one of the only places we can come to talk officiating and I've become very protective of it. Letting them hang around is like allowing the losing team's fans into your post-game conference.

Just my opinion.

[waenloteion]

I wasn't going to post again but I feel I must. I am sorry I was rude...I know what you mean about fans that only gripe and don't care about reality...the truth is I was so frustrated by what I think is a bad call that I overreacted...and unfortunately ya'lls haven was the first place I found. I mentioned earlier that I didn't realize what exactly this forum is about and that was the truth. In my frustration I was looking for anywhere to vent and this was the first place I found. I'm sorry for violating ya'lls safe haven and wish ya'll to know that. Also, it would be very interesting to see what other refs think of calls and that is why I have come back...I wanted to see what people were saying about the play. I do feel though..and you can take this or leave it...that sarcastic responses may not be the best way to get rid of aggravated fans as most of the time (my case included ) it usually leads to them becoming more aggravated (like me). So I guess the main point of this response is to apologize for my uneccesary behavior and just to get ya'lls opinion because as many of you have found out I'm not an official. So ya'll have a nice day and I am going to work on my temper problems and try to treat ya'll with the respect ya'll deserve instead of ragging on ya'll everytime I feel you made bad call.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by waenloteion

I do feel though..and you can take this or leave it...that sarcastic responses may not be the best way to get rid of aggravated fans as most of the time (my case included ) it usually leads to them becoming more aggravated (like me).

First off, apology accepted.
Second, regarding the portion quoted above:
Getting rid of "trolls" is really kind of a secondary goal.

Let me explain with an analogy. I know people who own land/homes in rural areas that are infested with prairie dogs. To keep the animals away from the house, one in particular will get out one of his high powered rifles and shoot them when they get too close. Shooting a couple of them keeps the rest at a distance.

For some (and some will find this apalling), it's also good target practice and entertainment.

Many refer to the annual influx of fans into this board as trolls. I prefer to call them prairie dogs.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by waenloteion

I wasn't going to post again but I feel I must. I am sorry I was rude...I know what you mean about fans that only gripe and don't care about reality...

Welcome to the forum. We certainly invite you to stick around if you wish to learn about the rules and discuss them. However, as you've as you found out, this isn't a place to complain about the officiating. Again, welcome to the forum...hopefully you'll stick around and learn a few things.

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

Tommy,

I really hesitate to jump in here because I don't want to openly disagree with you twice in one night. I've got no beef with you and I'm really not trying to get in your face. In fact I used to feel exactly the same way you do. I bristled at the way such people were treated here by people I otherwise respected. I was astonished and embarassed at their behavior. It seemed unfair, unfriendly, and unprovoked.

Then I lived through a few years of the annual parade of trolls during the playoffs and March Madness. In the next month they will come out of the woodwork and infest our board. They don't want rational explanations. They are in no mind to be fair, even-handed, or to learn. They are here only to gripe about how, in their completely biased opinion, their team was unfairly treated. Disagreeing with them, no matter how well-intentioned or -deserved, only invites their vitriol and venom.

I have finally come to agree with others that the best policy is to get rid of them as quickly as possible. There are thousands of places such trolls can go to whine. This is one of the only places we can come to talk officiating and I've become very protective of it. Letting them hang around is like allowing the losing team's fans into your post-game conference.

Just my opinion.

Well stated. Thank pulling this U2 out of the fire Crew Chief!

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by TRef21

Well stated. Thank pulling this U2 out of the fire Crew Chief!

No prob. It's what we U99's do

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

No prob. It's what we U99's do

LOL!

[Nevadaref]

I happened to be at a meeting this evening, so I recorded the game. After watching the final foul a few times I have to say that it clearly meets the definition of an intentional personal foul and it is a shame that Larry Rose, who was the Trail official tableside, only called a common foul.

Hank Nichols will likely be putting this play on a training video and might even send out a bulletin. He can't be happy after watching that clip.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I happened to be at a meeting this evening, so I recorded the game. After watching the final foul a few times I have to say that it clearly meets the definition of an intentional personal foul and it is a shame that Larry Rose, who was the Trail official tableside, only called a common foul.

Hank Nichols will likely be putting this play on a training video and might even send out a bulletin. He can't be happy after watching that clip.

It will not go on the training tape because the NCAA does not use plays from regular season games normally. It might go on a bulletin though.

Peace

[FrankHtown]

I believe a common recourse in the Big XII, is for the President of the afflicted school, to send a letter to somebody, demanding the game be declared "no contest"

[iref4him]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I happened to be at a meeting this evening, so I recorded the game. After watching the final foul a few times I have to say that it clearly meets the definition of an intentional personal foul and it is a shame that Larry Rose, who was the Trail official tableside, only called a common foul.

Hank Nichols will likely be putting this play on a training video and might even send out a bulletin. He can't be happy after watching that clip.

I thought it was an intentional foul too. But, how many times do we as officials not call the intentional. We are engrained to let the kids decide the game and sometimes we bend the role as not to be the bad guy. It was a smart play by Texas. Take a gamble. Most refs will do what they did. Call the common foul. Watch games and ask officials - most will say that I knew it was intentional but didn't want to call it.

[REFVA]

A lesson for the officials (?)...these are three big time guys

Officials: John Higgins, Larry Rose, Mike Wood

they are human, we all make mistakes. do you think these guys don't make mistakes? I have not seen the game but so I can't comment if there was a mistake or not just generalizing. we can't let any Fans come into this thread and blanket their frustration to all the officials on this web.IMO

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by iref4him

I thought it was an intentional foul too. But, how many times do we as officials not call the intentional. We are engrained to let the kids decide the game and sometimes we bend the role as not to be the bad guy. It was a smart play by Texas. Take a gamble. Most refs will do what they did. Call the common foul. Watch games and ask officials - most will say that I knew it was intentional but didn't want to call it.

If that is your opinion of most refs, then that is sad. I certainly am not one of those that is too scared to make the tough call when it is the right call just because it will be unpopular.
I consider the people that fall into your characterization to be weak, and I believe that they should quit officiating.

[cmathews]

at the box score, it appears that A&M only shot 65% or so from the stripe....so while the questionable call looks bad and comes at an inoportune time, that free throw percentage isn't going to win a lot of games

[Texas Aggie]

I'm clearly biased, but it was also clearly an intentional foul.