Stop Sign Not Considered Harmful

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

And you are right Snagwells, you are full of bull sh!t. Anywho, old chum, if you refer back to the NFHS POE Official Publication Basketball Guide 04-05 page 6:

"HAD ENOUGH? STOP SIGN EM"
Conversation with a coach during a game is something that will always occur. Somtimes that exchange of information between a coach and official is conversational and sometimes it is not. When and where to draw the line is debatable and depends on many variables. When you're made the decision to let the coach know you've heard enough, let him or her know visually as well as verbally. While verbally informaing the coach enough is enough, give the coach the stop sign. By giving the coach warning verbally and visually, your physical actions will be on tape. If the coach crosses the proverbial line after that point, you'll be on the record as giving a warning to the coach.

Read it and weep. Now I know you and JR will probably switch this to mean something else like you did my 3 second interrupted dribble in the lane. But that's okay because I know what I'm going to call and do in both these situations.

Um, Old School, whatinthehell is the NFHS Official Publication Basketball Guide 04-05?

Let me explain this to you real s-l-o-w-l-y.....

POE is short for "Points of Emphasis". POE's are found every year at the back of the NFHS rule book, right after Rule 10. They are also posted on the NFHS web site. They are not posted in the NFHS casebook, manual, comic book, etc.

Now, take a while and try to comprehend that.

Ready yet?

Not yet, eh?

How about now?

OK, we'll try to go a little further then. I am looking at the 2004-05 POE's found on pages 69 to 71 in the NFHS 2004-05 rule book. Nowhere in those POE's can be found any mention of stop sign usage. Further, I also have all of the rule book and associated POE's from 2000-01 on, and in NONE of them is found anything relating to stop sign usage either. And, for your further edification, page 6 of the 2004-05 rulebook shows the pictures of the people serving on that year's rules committee.

Now, knowing that you have never owned an NFHS rulebook in your entire officiating career/life, are you sure that you're not looking at something that your rec league maybe gave to you? You sureashell are NOT looking at any POE related to "stop signs".

It might help if you actually knew what a POE was in the first place too.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Um, Old School, whatinthehell is the NFHS Official Publication Basketball Guide 04-05?

POE is short for "Points of Emphasis". POE's are found every year at the back of the NFHS rule book, right after Rule 10. They are also posted on the NFHS web site. They are not posted in the NFHS casebook, manual, comic book, etc.

Now, knowing that you have never owned an NFHS rulebook in your entire officiating career/life, are you sure that you're not looking at something that your rec league maybe gave to you? You sureashell are NOT looking at any POE related to "stop signs".

It might help if you actually knew what a POE was in the first place too.

Now let me explain this to you real S.L.O.W.L.Y. Go to the link below, moron.

http://secure.referee.com/index.cfm?...Product_ID=304

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

Now let me explain this to you real S.L.O.W.L.Y. Go to the link below, moron.

http://secure.referee.com/index.cfm?...Product_ID=304

You honestly don't know or understand what a POE really is, do you? Sad.

That's a NASO/REFEREE booklet. All that little booklet does is reprint some of the NFHS stuff like new rules, etc. It's a Pre-season Guide only. If REFEREE does put something in that booklet, it's their own procedures, not the FEDs, and it sureashell isn't official in any way. Maybe your local rec league got a few of those back in 2004 to hand out to their officials in lieu of rulebooks, casebooks, manuals, etc., but these booklets don't have anything at all to do with NFHS-issued POE's.

If you had ever owned even one NFHS rulebook in your entire life, you might understand what I'm talking about.

Trying to officiate using a REFEREE magazine pre-season guide and no rule books.....Lah freaking me.....

Btw, moron? Tsk, tsk, tsk.....

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You honestly don't know or understand what a POE really is, do you? Sad.

That's a NASO/REFEREE booklet. All that little booklet does is reprint some of the NFHS stuff like new rules, etc. It's a Pre-season Guide only. If REFEREE does put something in that booklet, it's their own procedures, not the FEDs, and it sureashell isn't official in any way.

This actually is not true. It is an official NF Publication. It says so on the guide.

Continue on with your little spat.

Peace

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This actually is not true. It is an official NF Publication. It says so on the guide.

Continue on with your little spat.

Yeah, I have the Oscars on "in the background".
This thread is more entertaining!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This actually is not true. It is an official NF Publication. It says so on the guide.

Continue on with your little spat.

Um, no. I've seen one of those booklets. REFEREE throws in some new rules, etc. issued by the FED, but do add some of their own content. The actual FED content in the booklet is just reprinted. Anything that REFEREE adds means nothing about nothing officially.

If you go to the FED website and check out what they're selling, you won't find that pre-season booklet anywhere. I just looked and I couldn't find it.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Old School

And you are right SNAQWELLS, you are full of bull sh!t. Anywho, old chum, if you refer back to the NFHS POE Official Publication Basketball Guide 04-05 page 6:

So you pull some third rate publication out of your azz and think it proves that ...

Originally Posted by Old School

The art of the stop sign was a point of emphasis a couple of years ago in NFHS.

Now it's just getting funny. You can't possibly be this obtuse.
BTW, I've been known to be full of $hit. This isn't one of those times. "Referee Magazine" does not equal a rule book.

Originally Posted by Old School

Now I know you and JR will probably switch this to mean something else like you did my 3 second interrupted dribble in the lane. But that's okay because I know what I'm going to call and do in both these situations.

Good grief, you got thoroughly exposed as a fraud in that debate, we didn't have to twist anything. I claimed the three second count continues during an interrupted dribble, you disagreed. It was pretty straight forward. Perhaps you can point to where I or JR twisted or shifted anything? I doubt it, but will apologize if you can show that I twisted your meanings in any way.
You do what you want, and as long as you're consistently wrong about it in your intramural games, no one will really care.

[BillyMac]

I'm a little slower than most Forum members so I'm a little confused.

What is the relationship between the the NASO/Referee Preseason Basketball Guide and the NFHS? I don't know what term to use, but I'll give it a shot. Is this Preseason Basketball Guide affiliated with, authorized by, or in any way connected to, or condoned by the NFHS? Can items in this publication be used to cite NFHS rule and/or interpretion situations and plays, with the backing of the NFHS? Does anyone know if anything appearing in this publication has ever later been rejected by the NFHS as not applying to NFHS rules or interpretations?

I hope that there is a Forum member out there who can answer some of these questions with facts and not with opinions. That may help us to once and for all "bury" the issue about the "stop sign". Has or does the NFHS, not the NASO or Referee, suggest that officials may use a visual warning to indicate to the coach, and to the video tape, and possibly to the crowd, and to your partner, that "enough is enough"?

[JRutledge]

All I can say is if a publication puts on the front their affiliation with a particular organization I would think the contents are pretty official. If they did not want you to think that, then they would not put their name on it. If someone writes a book does it matter who actually wrote the contents? I am not sure how official it gets than that. Are we going to know debate which company actually did the printing to make sure that the NF had something to do with that too?

Peace

[Mountaineer]

Originally Posted by Old School

Now let me explain this to you real S.L.O.W.L.Y. Go to the link below, moron.

http://secure.referee.com/index.cfm?...Product_ID=304

OK, this thing is published by the National Association of Sports Officials - same people that put out the Referee magazine. While that magazine does offer some good topics - many of the things in there are just plain wrong. It is not a NFHS publication - the address of the company that publishes this is in Wisconsin not Indianapolis. While they may have some sort of an endorsement from the federation it does not make it gospel.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer

OK, this thing is published by the National Association of Sports Officials - same people that put out the Referee magazine. While that magazine does offer some good topics - many of the things in there are just plain wrong. It is not a NFHS publication - the address of the company that publishes this is in Wisconsin not Indianapolis. While they may have some sort of an endorsement from the federation it does not make it gospel.

You need to blow up the picture. In the top right hand corner the words, "Official Publication of the NFHS" is listed.

I am looking at a 2007 Baseball NFHS Preseason Guide as we speak. My state gives out these guides in all sports that I work currently and have been doing so for probably 4 or 5 years now.

I am not trying to agree with the debate of what was listed, but this is an official publication from the NF. I have no idea if what Old School claimed was even in the publication. But to keep saying it is not official is not only wrong, it is completely wrong.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You need to blow up the picture. In the top right hand corner the words, "Official Publication of the NFHS" is listed.

I am looking at a 2007 Baseball NFHS Preseason Guide as we speak. My state gives out these guides in all sports that I work currently and have been doing so for probably 4 or 5 years now.

I am not trying to agree with the debate of what was listed, but this is an official publication from the NF. I have no idea if what Old School claimed was even in the publication. But to keep saying it is not official is not only wrong, it is completely wrong.

Peace

Again, no matter what, there was NO POE issued in 2004-05 related to stop signs. Afaik, there has NEVER been a POE issued re: stop signs. I have the rule books going back to 2000 and I have already looked through them; there is NO POE in any of them related to stop signs. What OS found in some handout from his rec league is NOT and NEVER will be a POE. Old School doesn't even know whatthehell a POE actually is.

If there was something in that booklet, again no matter what, it was NOT a POE and wasn't relevant to this discussion. If it hadda been a POE, it woulda been in the rule book. That's the bottom line to Old School's stoopid claim.

[JRutledge]

I only posted to clarify that what was said was wrong on who produces the Pre-Season Guidebook. I realize there was no POE about this. I never agreed with that part of this thread.

Peace

[NewNCref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

What OS found in some handout from his rec league is NOT and NEVER will be a POE.

I have my rec league handouts here, and I have no mention of stop signs here either, so mark that one off too, JR.

Okay, sorry, just trying to provide some comic relief.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Again, no matter what, there was NO POE issued in 2004-05 related to stop signs. Afaik, there has NEVER been a POE issued re: stop signs. I have the rule books going back to 2000 and I have already looked through them; there is NO POE in any of them related to stop signs. What OS found in some handout from his rec league is NOT and NEVER will be a POE. Old School doesn't even know whatthehell a POE actually is.

If there was something in that booklet, again no matter what, it was NOT a POE and wasn't relevant to this discussion. If it hadda been a POE, it woulda been in the rule book. That's the bottom line to Old School's stoopid claim.

No matter what you think, it is a fact. Do you think I just made that up. Go back and reread what I posted. You might be able to get the official copy from Referee magazine for back then.