T the Varsity coach

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Small problem.

If he came out of the stands, and he wasn't on the bench or listed as being one of the JV coaches, then he is a fan. .

Maybe where you are but that's not the interpretation here. As stmaryrams stated, he is part of the basketball staff and is expected to conduct himself according to the rules at all times. If he comes out of the stands on me, one T and he's done. And we will having backing from the local and state associations if that happens.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

What I won't do, because there is absolutely NO rules backing to do so, is penalize that "fan" as being part of the JV coaching staff. He might be "inserting himself as staff", but that doesn't make him a JV coach, and you can't penalize him as such, rules-wise.

Again, never do what can't be explained logically or can't be justified by the rules. And trying to morph a fan coming out of the stands into a bench coach fails both of those tests imo.

So you're telling us that a T cannot be assessed to a team for the behavior of a team supporter? I don't think so my geriatric partner.

If he's a coach from that school, I have no problem sticking him in the a$$ and chunking him. And I am backed by rule.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Maybe where you are but that's not the interpretation here. As stmaryrams stated, he is part of the basketball staff and is expected to conduct himself according to the rules at all times. If he comes out of the stands on me, one T and he's done. And we will having backing from the local and state associations if that happens.

So you're telling us that a T cannot be assessed to a team for the behavior of a team supporter? I don't think so my geriatric partner.

Um, no. I never said that anywhere. I said verbatim- "It's usually a last resort to throw "T"s at at fans anyway". Basically, that's exactly what case book play 2.8.1 recommends--"this authority must be used with extreme caution and discretion". I agree with the direction that the FED has given us.

And I 'll stick to my previous statements too. Someone who is in the stands is NOT a bench coach, by rule. Unless the Varsity coach is specifically listed on the score sheet as an assistant coach, he's a fan.

If you consider the Varsity coach as part of the JV staff, then are you prepared to immediately "T" up the varsity coach when you see him up in the stands? Even before he says something? After all, if you want to insist that he's an assistant JV coach, then he's illegally off the bench as per rule 10-4-4, isn't he?

[BktBallRef]

Sure you did. You wrote, "Again, never do what can't be explained logically or can't be justified by the rules."

Now, please, please, please tell me where I wrote that he was part of the JV staff. I said he's part of the basketball coaching staff at the school. If he starts abusing officials, whether standing on the floor or sitting in the stands, I have no problem calling a technical foul on him and getting rid of him. The JV coach is not going to lose the coaching box but his team will be penalized for this coach's behavior. Further, the NCHSAA is going to get rid of him for two more games, at the JV and varsity level.

As long as he's sitting in the stands, setting a proper example and not inserting himself into the game, he can sit there forever. Ordinary fan pulls that crap, who cares? But this guy knows better and he'll pay the price.

Again, thankfully, we have the local and state association backing. Using the fan rule to apply to this situation is perfectly legal and acceptable.

[Mountaineer]

Originally Posted by stmaryrams

I did have a similar sitch with a varsity coach at a jv game. My partner had a call which got the bench in an uproar. He called a violation for crossing the restraining line. Only problem was there was no restraining line. We have several gyms in the city league that use them but this one does not need one. There was a tape line about 5 feet parallel to the side line, dashed for some kind of gym class thing and my partner called that line. Funny in pregame, captains and coaches meetings we never discussed this because it wasn't a restraining line. Partner makes the call, bench erupts and this guy comes out of the stands to complain on the edge of the floor. I come over to help calm everyone and tell this guy to get back in the stands. He says "I'm the varsity coach" so I "T" him up as he is a part of the staff. I then told him to sit down so he can do his game tonight. He says it doesn't carry over and I replied that it will if you are thrown out of the gym for the night. He relented and sat down. I never could get a good explaination from my partner why he called what he did and I've always tried to avoid working with this guy since.

It's not our job to enforce the coach's sitting out the next game. At least in WV. I had a tournament game on a Friday and ejected a coach. I called our governing association and asked the interpreter who told me to simply write a report if he coaches and let the association deal with it - but I cannot stop him from coaching.