Pick up game dispute regarding block/charge/no call

[ATXCoach]

Player A (Offense) drives the basket for a lay up. Player B (Defense) slides over to take a charge. Player A steps on Player B's foot a goes down. Player A does not contact Player B's body until he's clearly falling.

Is it a travel or block?

It seems obvious that if B is standing there (legally established) and A steps on his foot and falls with the ball then it's a travel.

I don't know how to articulate well the fact that B may still be moving and had A not stepped on B's foot then B would have clearly contacted A's body.

Is there a scenario where A's foot has more right to the spot on the floor than B's foot?

Thank

[Jurassic Referee]

If the defender established and maintained a legal guarding position, then the dribbler stepping on the defender's foot would not be a foul on the defender. The only time that it would be a foul on the defender was if the defender had lost their LGP.

[Gimlet25id]

LGP...both feet on the floor and facing the dribbler/ball handler. No time and distance is required. Once this position is obtained the defender can move laterally, back wards, and even defend his/herself. Therefore any contact that is made between the offense player and defensive player would be initiated by the offensive player. In your case if the offensive player steps on the defenders foot and falls, travel would be a great call. If they just kind of meet and the offensive player loses the ball then maybe a no call would be in order.

[deecee]

how about if A's sock has more right to a spot than B's sock?

who tries to take a charge in a pick up game anyway?

[ATXCoach]

Thanks guys,

I don't think taking a charge was the intent of the Defender. To me it looked like he was trying to block the shot/stop the layup by fouling. I would not say he had LGP, but as has been made clear to me before on here - I don't know anything about the rules

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by ATXCoach

Thanks guys,

I don't think taking a charge was the intent of the Defender. To me it looked like he was trying to block the shot/stop the layup by fouling. I would not say he had LGP, but as has been made clear to me before on here - I don't know anything about the rules

Well first you say he "slides over to take a charge" now you say he was borderline intentional foul.

I don't thimk the problem is with your understanding of the rules.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Well first you say he "slides over to take a charge" now you say he was borderline intentional foul.

I don't thimk the problem is with your understanding of the rules.

Thimk?

We really, really need to talk that little sh!t from MASS into coming back. The place is falling apart.

[ATXCoach]

Thanks Dan for the kind words . I'm stupid to try and justify my posts, but I will.

****

Player A (Offense) drives the basket for a lay up. Player B (Defense) slides over to take a charge. Player A steps on Player B's foot a goes down. Player A does not contact Player B's body until he's clearly falling.

Is it a travel or block?

This was an attempt to try and leave all possibilities open and see what responses I got.

It seems obvious that if B is standing there (legally established) and A steps on his foot and falls with the ball then it's a travel.

I didn't think anyone would call a charge so I left that option out.

I don't know how to articulate well the fact that B may still be moving and had A not stepped on B's foot then B would have clearly contacted A's body.

Is there a scenario where A's foot has more right to the spot on the floor than B's foot?

This is an attempt to be more specific (i.e. Player B was commiting a "borderline intentional foul", but before the foul could occur, A stepped on B's foot). Clearly I didn't want to come out and say that it was malicious or intended to harm, just that B wasn't going to allow the layup, because I figured this would steer the discussion in another direction. I also mentioned that I was having trouble coming up with the words to explain myself.

Thank

This was a typo. Should have been Thanks or Thank you.

***

So I don't really believe that I have changed my story. I did not seperate well the specific scenario from the general scenario in my initial post, and for that I appologize. I will attempt to clear up my posts in the future.

The 2nd post was in response to deecee's post, and I offered my opinion as to the play I witnessed and the 10 minute argument that followed.

I personally think it was a blocking foul because B never established LGP (in my ignorant opinion), but would you call a blocking foul (or I guess tripping maybe) if clearly the Defender was playing the ball/stopping the layup/thinking of fouling and the feet got tangled and no other contact occurred?

Dang it, now I wrote to much and I'm opening myself up to more critizism.

Thanks in advance for all the serious responses and fire away to the rest of you.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by ATXCoach

Dang it, now I wrote to much and I'm opening myself up to more critizism.

JR, maybe you'r right . To much pore spelling and grammer going on for us to up with put.

Thanks in advance for all the serious responses and fire away to the rest of you.

Wait, I know...this is National Act Like A 12 Year Old Girl Day! Passive aggression runs amok...but I can't see how all this eye rolling is good for anybody.

But you're waiting for a serious response to your pick up game question. Here's what I do: since I've asked each player before hand if they have a medical condition I should be aware of I know that A1 has actually suffered a cerebral hemorrhage. Armed with this information and my trusty boy scout knife I drill a hole in his skull for the blood to escape from, thereby reducing brain swelling and saving him from having to sue me.

Whether I call a block or a travel depends entirely on B1's movement and position prior to the contact.

We now return you to our regularly schedule program, That's So Raven.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

JR, maybe you'r right . To much pore spelling and grammer going on for us to up with put.

Well, I thought that the equally-annoying little feller from Nevada was all set to take on Chuck's mantle.....but then he went ahead and flunked remedial spelling.

We may have to advertise the position in Business Week or the NY Times. Or Mad Magazine.

Btw, how does one go about joining that "clique" thingy that your bud, BZ, was talking about? Is there an entrance exam? Do you have to pass a physical( between you and me, you shoulda put a minimum height requirement in on the last one. That might have kept out the riff-raff)? Can I get the exam and answers from Whistles & Stripes before I have to write it? Are wimmen allowed to join in any capacity other than serving wench?

Sigh....so many questions.....

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Well, I thought that the equally-annoying little feller from Nevada was all set to take on Chuck's mantle.....but then he went ahead and flunked remedial spelling.

We may have to advertise the position in Business Week or the NY Times. Or Mad Magazine.

Btw, how does one go about joining that "clique" thingy that your bud, BZ, was talking about? Is there an entrance exam? Do you have to pass a physical( between you and me, you shoulda put a minimum height requirement in on the last one. That might have kept out the riff-raff)? Can I get the exam and answers from Whistles & Stripes before I have to write it? Are wimmen allowed to join in any capacity other than serving wench?

Look, for the last f'ing time there aint no damn clique, click or klick. So forget about joining, 'cause we all got together and decided YOU AINT IN!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Look, for the last f'ing time there aint no damn clique, click or klick. So forget about joining, 'cause we all got together and decided YOU AINT IN!

You hurt my feelings.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You hurt my feelings.

Oh geeze look what I did now...ok look, we all got together and decided you can join the click clique klick, except there is no click clique klick...but if we did have a click clique klick your name would definitely be on the list of people who want to join!

Feel better now??