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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 05:07pm
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Backcourt violation?

Another one I am not sure on but should be and appreciate getting straight:

A1 is in his backcourt and passes the ball to A2 in the front court who is covered by B1 . A2 cannot control the pass off his hands and it goes back in the backcourt where he retrieves it? Is this a backcourt violation? My uncertainty comes from the lack of team control by A in the frontcourt. However team control exists during passes so I think it would be a violation. Is this right??? Thanks for the feedback.

PS - How about if the pass hit off B1 and then A2 before going into the backcourt. I assume ruling would be the same.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 05:16pm
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It is a violation. There is TEAM control during the entire play. What confused you is that A2 never had PLAYER control. However, that is not a requirement for a backcourt violation.

If the ball was first deflected by B1 and then went off A2's hands, it would still be a violation. The important thing to remember is which team is the last to touch the ball before it goes into the backcourt.

Therefore, the reverse would not be a violation. (Off A2's hands then deflected away and into the backcourt by B1.)

PS There is a case book play for your situation:
9.9.1 SITUATION C: A1 is dribbling in his/her backcourt and throws a pass to the frontcourt. While standing in A's frontcourt: (a) A2 or (b) B3 touches the ball and deflects it back to A's backcourt. A2 recovers in the backcourt. RULING: In (a), it is a violation. The ball was in control of Team A, and a player from A was the last to touch the ball in frontcourt and a player of A was the first to touch it after it returned to the back court. In (b), legal play. A Team A player was not the last to touch the ball in the frontcourt. Team A is entitled to a new 10-second count.

Last edited by Nevadaref; Mon Nov 06, 2006 at 07:02pm.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 05:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vawils
Another one I am not sure on but should be and appreciate getting straight:

A1 is in his backcourt and passes the ball to A2 in the front court who is covered by B1 . A2 cannot control the pass off his hands and it goes back in the backcourt where he retrieves it? Is this a backcourt violation? My uncertainty comes from the lack of team control by A in the frontcourt. However team control exists during passes so I think it would be a violation. Is this right??? Thanks for the feedback.

PS - How about if the pass hit off B1 and then A2 before going into the backcourt. I assume ruling would be the same.
Team control was never lost by team A. Player control was lost, but that isn't really a relevant factor. What you have to ascertain is if the ball ever gained frontcourt status. If it hit A2 in the frontcourt, it did.

Rule 9-9-1 says "A player shall not be the first to touch a ball after it has been in team control in the frontcourt, if he/she or a teammate last touched or was touched by the ball in the frontcourt before it went into the backcourt".
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:46pm
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But doesn't the ball not obtain frontcourt status until both feet of a player and the ball have moved it into the front court?
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:50pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkeii
But doesn't the ball not obtain frontcourt status until both feet of a player and the ball have moved it into the front court?
That only applies to a player who is DRIBBLING the ball.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:50pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkeii
But doesn't the ball not obtain frontcourt status until both feet of a player and the ball have moved it into the front court?
That's only on when there's a dribbler bringing the ball across the division line, David.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:53pm
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................
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:54pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef
That's only on when there's a dribbler bringing the ball across the division line, David.
As I recall, the rule doesn't say dribbling - it says for the player to be considered to be in the frontcourt, they must have both feet and the ball in the frontcourt - I'll look it up when I get home, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't day "when dribbling the ball".
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:55pm
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David, how long have you and I been posting on this board? Do you really think I'd be wrong about something like this?

4-4-6
During a dribble from backcourt to frontcourt, the ball is in the frontcourt when the ball and both feet of the dribbler touch the court entirely in the frontcourt.
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Last edited by BktBallRef; Mon Nov 06, 2006 at 07:02pm.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:57pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef
David, how long have you and I been posting on this board? Do you really think I'd be wrong about something like this?
Well, I'm asking - that's all - I don't remember anything in there that says "When dribbling" - and you can't presume something like that is in there - I'll look when I get home, which is in about 15 minutes...

BTW, can you email me a copy of that handheld rule book? That would come in great handy, me having a Treo 650 and all... Thanks in advance!
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:58pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkeii
As I recall, the rule doesn't say dribbling - it says for the player to be considered to be in the frontcourt, they must have both feet and the ball in the frontcourt - I'll look it up when I get home, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't day "when dribbling the ball".
RULE 4, SECTION 4 BALL LOCATION, AT DISPOSAL

ART. 6 . . . During a dribble from backcourt to frontcourt, the ball is in the frontcourt when the ball and both feet of the dribbler touch the court entirely in the frontcourt.
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 06:59pm
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NV, dammit!!! Now cut that out!!!
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 07:00pm
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Hey Tony,
Twice in one thread!!! ... ... ...
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 07:02pm
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I'll fix your a$$!
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Old Mon Nov 06, 2006, 07:06pm
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Am I being a pain in the a$$?

LMAO!
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