The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 12:37pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 18
Travel or not??

Player A receives an outlet pass, pivots, and attempts to throw a long pass down the court, in the pass attempt the ball slips out during the pass attempt. Player A retreives the ball after moving three steps. Travel or not??
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 12:45pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Just north of hell
Posts: 9,250
Send a message via AIM to Dan_ref
Depends on if you judged the player to have fumbled the ball or passed the ball.

If a fumble (accidental loss of control when he unintentionally drops it) then it's legal. You can always recover your own fumble. If a pass (movement of ball when a player throws, bats or rolls ball) then it's a travel.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 12:50pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 9,466
Send a message via AIM to rainmaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_ref
Depends on if you judged the player to have fumbled the ball or passed the ball.

If a fumble (accidental loss of control when he unintentionally drops it) then it's legal. You can always recover your own fumble. If a pass (movement of ball when a player throws, bats or rolls ball) then it's a travel.
Even if A1 never dribbled? Catch with two hands, the ball goes somewhere but A1 doesn't touch it, three steps, catch with two hands. If you call it a pass, that's illegal? Hmmmmm....
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 12:57pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Irving, Texas
Posts: 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainmaker
Even if A1 never dribbled? Catch with two hands, the ball goes somewhere but A1 doesn't touch it, three steps, catch with two hands. If you call it a pass, that's illegal? Hmmmmm....
I agree with you and as we both know, you are correct. With dribble still available, it depends on whether the ball bounced.
__________________
- SamIAm (Senior Registered User) - (Concerning all judgement calls - they depend on age, ability, and severity)
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 01:01pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 9,466
Send a message via AIM to rainmaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by SamIAm
I agree with you and as we both know, you are correct.
I quit knowing I was correct a long, long time ago. Especially when it's Dan or Woddy or Tiny or BITS that's doing the correcting (so you guys are back on the list now, OKAY?? Sheez...). That's why I worded it Jeopardy-style.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 01:07pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 18
Travel or not?? Follow Up

To continue the discussion on the initial Travel or not?? situation, would it be a travel if the player would have dribbled the ball, picked up the dribble, then during the passing attempt loses, slips out, or fumbles the pass?
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 01:10pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Just north of hell
Posts: 9,250
Send a message via AIM to Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainmaker
Even if A1 never dribbled? Catch with two hands, the ball goes somewhere but A1 doesn't touch it, three steps, catch with two hands. If you call it a pass, that's illegal? Hmmmmm....
Not sure what your sitch is.

If A1 doesn't cleanly catch the pass it's a fumble. He can recover. In this case there is no pass.

If A1 holds the ball & then passes it he has traveled if his pivot foot is lifted & returns to the floor and the ball doesn't touch the floor before he recovers it. This is the illegal play I had in mind..."caught his own pass".

If the ball hits the floor first it's a dribble and legal unless his pivot foot was lifted before the pass (ie start of dribble).

If he doesn't move his pivot foot then it can't be a travel regardless of whether he passes the ball to himself or fumbles & recovers it.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 01:19pm
Nu1 Nu1 is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 132
As you described, A1 caught the ball, pivoted, and threw the ball down court.
If the ball hits the floor before A1 touches it, it's legal. If A1 does not allow the ball to touch the floor first, it is illegal.

However, would it be a travel or an illegal dribble? It seems the rules would indicate a thrown ball that is retrieved, that didn't hit the floor, would be (a) an illegal dribble, if the player's pivot foot was on the floor, and (b) a travel, if the player's pivot foot was off the floor.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 02:46pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Champaign, IL
Posts: 5,687
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainmaker
I quit knowing I was correct a long, long time ago. Especially when it's Dan or Woddy or Tiny or BITS that's doing the correcting (so you guys are back on the list now, OKAY?? Sheez...).
So, what am I? Chopped liver?

In the original sitch, it sounds like he already made the decision - " the ball slips out during the pass attempt". That sounds like a fumble, so the ball can be recovered without penalty.
__________________
M&M's - The Official Candy of the Department of Redundancy Department.

(Used with permission.)
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 02:56pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 13,814
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
So, what am I? Chopped liver?

In the original sitch, it sounds like he already made the decision - " the ball slips out during the pass attempt". That sounds like a fumble, so the ball can be recovered without penalty.
Unless you're Tom Brady, then the "tuck rule" applies, meaning it was a pass attempt, meaning you can't recover the ball.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 03:16pm
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,213
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef
Unless you're Tom Brady, then the "tuck rule" applies, meaning it was a pass attempt, meaning you can't recover the ball.
Isn't it really a judgement call, as everybody else seems to imply?

Pass attempt----> travel

Fumble recovery----> legal
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 03:20pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Western Mass.
Posts: 9,104
Send a message via AIM to ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Pass attempt----> travel
Unless A1 has not yet dribbled, as Juulie pointed out in post #3 above. If A1 had not yet dribbled, then that pass is just the start of his/her dribble (as long as it touches the floor).
__________________
Any NCAA rules and interpretations in this post are relevant for men's games only!
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 03:37pm
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,213
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckElias
Unless A1 has not yet dribbled, as Juulie pointed out in post #3 above. If A1 had not yet dribbled, then that pass is just the start of his/her dribble (as long as it touches the floor).
It was taken that A1 had already dribbled as a given, as several other posters implied.

So.....shut up.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 03:39pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: In the offseason.
Posts: 11,990
I think the real question is really whether it is a pass or a fumble. What can happen next is not an issue once that question is answered.

So, a player starts the motions that looks like a pass but clearly changes his mind and attempts to hold onto the ball before releasing it. If it still slips out, I think that is a fumble since the player didn't intend to release the ball....it slipped from his grasp.
__________________
Owner/Developer of RefTown.com

Last edited by Camron Rust; Fri Sep 22, 2006 at 06:11pm.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Fri Sep 22, 2006, 03:41pm
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust
I think the real question is really whether it is a pass or a fumble.
Agreed. Any succeeding call depends on that determination.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Not a travel--since when? mplagrow Basketball 19 Fri Feb 13, 2004 01:09pm
Travel or Not?? ref18 Basketball 2 Wed Jan 21, 2004 08:50pm
When is getting up a travel? CYO Butch Basketball 23 Tue Jan 20, 2004 11:28am
A travel or not a travel RefJeff Basketball 4 Wed Oct 01, 2003 12:19pm
No Travel, Just Kidding Travel Kas v Arz fletch_irwin_m Basketball 49 Tue Apr 08, 2003 06:23pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:41am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1