Grey Shirts

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

2-1-1 . . . The official's uniform shall be a black-and-white striped shirt, black pants, shoes and socks.

This has nothing to do with grey shirts, but I don't want to start a new thread.

But are the side-panel shirts "college" shirts. I know they were widely used in the tournament last year and that's how they are being advertised.

However, all the major sellers of official's gear (Honig's, Gerry Davis, etc.) don't say not for high school use (like they do for the CCA logo).

Nevadaref has provided the official's uniform reference... the shirt seems to meet the requirement....your thoughts for use in Fed games?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by tjones1

This has nothing to do with grey shirts, but I don't want to start a new thread.

But are the side-panel shirts "college" shirts. I know they were widely used in the tournament last year and that's how they are being advertised.

However, all the major sellers of official's gear (Honig's, Gerry Davis, etc.) don't say not for high school use (like they do for the CCA logo).

Nevadaref has provided the official's uniform reference... the shirt seems to meet the requirement....your thoughts for use in Fed games?

Unless there is something very specifically said I see no problem with these shirts being worn. I even asked this question of two well known people and I got different responses. So unless someone says something publicly or directly, then I see nothing with wearing them. Just understand that someone might at some point outlaw these shirts. The shirts are still black and white. The only difference is the panel which in my opinion is really not that noticeable.

Peace

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by tjones1

Nevadaref has provided the official's uniform reference... the shirt seems to meet the requirement....your thoughts for use in Fed games?

I don't really have a firm opinion on the wide-panel zebra shirt. I do know that the NCAA modified their rule book to explicitly allow the wearing of it a couple of years ago. So perhaps without a similar change in the NFHS book, this shirt should be considered not to meet the current standards.

On the other hand it is hard to argue that it is not a black and white striped shirt! So my thoughts on the actual wearing of it are:

1. It should only be worn if the ENTIRE crew is wearing it. The officials are a team and their uniform needs to be the same. I have seen a couple of HS games in which only one official on the court wore this shirt and it did make him stand out.

2. The thick black stripe IS noticeable. It stands out every time an official raises his arm for a foul or violation. If that side of the official's body is facing the table, the coaches especially take notice of the different look. This was particularly true in the game that I mentioned in #1. So much so that one coach became upset because he felt that whenever "the official with the stripe" made a call it went against his team. He became fixated on the guy with the stripe and it eventually led to his removal.

3. At this time people in the basketball community do understand this shirt to be a "college shirt." I'm would be wary of giving the impression that the officials are big timing the HS game by wearing it.

4. There will be some adjustment period visually, but as this shirt becomes more prevalent the problem of #3 should disappear as people get used to seeing this style of jersey on the officials. That is normal for any change.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I don't really have a firm opinion on the wide-panel zebra shirt. I do know that the NCAA modified their rule book to explicitly allow the wearing of it a couple of years ago. So perhaps without a similar change in the NFHS book, this shirt should be considered not to meet the current standards.

On the other hand it is hard to argue that it is not a black and white striped shirt! So my thoughts on the actual wearing of it are:

1. It should only be worn if the ENTIRE crew is wearing it. The officials are a team and their uniform needs to be the same. I have seen a couple of HS games in which only one official on the court wore this shirt and it did make him stand out.

2. The thick black stripe IS noticeable. It stands out every time an official raises his arm for a foul or violation. If that side of the official's body is facing the table, the coaches especially take notice of the different look. This was particularly true in the game that I mentioned in #1. So much so that one coach became upset because he felt that whenever "the official with the stripe" made a call it went against his team. He became fixated on the guy with the stripe and it eventually led to his removal.

So what you're saying is because this 1 official wore the shirt with the wide black side panels instead of the standard shirt he got on the coaches nerves and this led the coach getting not 1 but 2 T's. And if he was wearing a regular shirt the coach would have been a happy little lamb and would have happily accepted any call that came his way.

This is what you're telling us?

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

So what you're saying is because this 1 official wore the shirt with the wide black side panels instead of the standard shirt he got on the coaches nerves and this led the coach getting not 1 but 2 T's. And if he was wearing a regular shirt the coach would have been a happy little lamb and would have happily accepted any call that came his way.

This is what you're telling us?

I think what Nev is saying is that because the official stood out it was more obvious to the coach that the calls he disagreed with were coming from just that one official. Seldom does a coach go off at an entire crew to the point that he gets tossed. It's difficult to get that worked up at a group. It's more often the case that he goes off at a single official.

Of course we'll never know whether the coach would have been tossed had they been identically attired. It's not that difficult to identify individual members of a crew by height, weight, gender, skin color, hair color, etc. But you usually have to be paying some added attention to realize that the taller official has all the calls against you. Throw in something so eye-catchingly novel as the wide black panel and you can't help noticing it's the same guy time after time. Why stand out like that?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

Of course we'll never know whether the coach would have been tossed had they been identically attired. It's not that difficult to identify individual members of a crew by height, weight, gender, skin color, hair color, etc. But you usually have to be paying some added attention to realize that the taller official has all the calls against you. Throw in something so eye-catchingly novel as the wide black panel and you can't help noticing it's the same guy time after time. Why stand out like that?

So all these years the only way I have ever been identified or my partners have been identified on the court is by the shirts we wear? Man, I cannot wait until I actually wear one of these shirts during a game. Then when they talk about the fat referee or the guy with grey hair, they really can identify us.

Peace

[dblref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

So all these years the only way I have ever been identified or my partners have been identified on the court is by the shirts we wear? Man, I cannot wait until I actually wear one of these shirts during a game. Then when they talk about the fat referee or the guy with grey hair, they really can identify us.

Peace

Unfortunately Jeff, someof the fat referees also have grey hair and vice versa, so it will still be difficult to distinguish between the officials.

[Texas Aggie]

So what you are telling me it is OK to have crew members where three different shirts without the panels, but to wear the panels is a no-no? For example on official wears the polyester, one wears the micro-mesh, and the third official wears the poly-cotton. All three shirts look different.

No, that's not what he's telling you, and no, they don't look different enough for anyone to notice, assuming the poly-cotton hasn't faded.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

On the other hand it is hard to argue that it is not a black and white striped shirt! So my thoughts on the actual wearing of it are:

1. It should only be worn if the ENTIRE crew is wearing it. The officials are a team and their uniform needs to be the same. I have seen a couple of HS games in which only one official on the court wore this shirt and it did make him stand out.

So what you are telling me it is OK to have crew members where three different shirts without the panels, but to wear the panels is a no-no? For example on official wears the polyester, one wears the micro-mesh, and the third official wears the poly-cotton. All three shirts look different.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

2. The thick black stripe IS noticeable. It stands out every time an official raises his arm for a foul or violation. If that side of the official's body is facing the table, the coaches especially take notice of the different look. This was particularly true in the game that I mentioned in #1. So much so that one coach became upset because he felt that whenever "the official with the stripe" made a call it went against his team. He became fixated on the guy with the stripe and it eventually led to his removal.

You are kidding right? I guess officials should not have different body types, be different races or different genders. I have heard coaches make a point of all these things and I hardly ever work on a crew where I am the same race as both my partners or in many cases I am not the same gender and I definitely do not have the same body type as my partners and I always hear my partners singled out by their features and look. I guess we all should wear the exact same pants too.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

3. At this time people in the basketball community do understand this shirt to be a "college shirt." I'm would be wary of giving the impression that the officials are big timing the HS game by wearing it.

Funny, I did not have one person even comment on it when I wore them all summer. The only feedback I got was when I asked someone directly about wearing them. So far I have not gotten a clear answer.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

4. There will be some adjustment period visually, but as this shirt becomes more prevalent the problem of #3 should disappear as people get used to seeing this style of jersey on the officials. That is normal for any change.

That is about the only thing I agree with.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

They go to what they see, evidently without looking at their partner. Same thing happened in the Carolina-Winthrop game tonight.

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I don't really have a firm opinion on the wide-panel zebra shirt. I do know that the NCAA modified their rule book to explicitly allow the wearing of it a couple of years ago. So perhaps without a similar change in the NFHS book, this shirt should be considered not to meet the current standards.

On the other hand it is hard to argue that it is not a black and white striped shirt! So my thoughts on the actual wearing of it are:

1. It should only be worn if the ENTIRE crew is wearing it. The officials are a team and their uniform needs to be the same. I have seen a couple of HS games in which only one official on the court wore this shirt and it did make him stand out.

2. The thick black stripe IS noticeable. It stands out every time an official raises his arm for a foul or violation. If that side of the official's body is facing the table, the coaches especially take notice of the different look. This was particularly true in the game that I mentioned in #1. So much so that one coach became upset because he felt that whenever "the official with the stripe" made a call it went against his team. He became fixated on the guy with the stripe and it eventually led to his removal.

I immediately noticed that Bernard Clinton was wearing a "side-panel" shirt while Lopes and Kitts weren't. Did the "side panel" play any factor into the calling of the "blarge"? I didn't watch the game past the the first TV time-out so I didn't personally see the "blarge". I do notice in the box score that Winthrop only shot 1 free throw. I wonder if the fact that they attempted 38 3-pointers had anything to do with that or will some Winthrop fanboy come on this site complaining the UNC was getting all the calls?