2006 Proposed Rule Revisions

[Rich]

I'm in favor of the following. In places where I'm conditionally in favor, I'll make comments:

1. 28 ft coaching box
2. permitting gray shirt for officials
7. include a foul committed during a throw-in by the throwing team as a team control foul
9. play in halves instead of quarters
12. eliminate lag time if officials have definite knowledge of the time
15. allow a shot clock by state adoption
16. courtside replay for state championship games
17. assessing only one delay of game warning for any type of delay of game situation per team instead of one for each of the three types.
18. allow pregame dunking, but not hanging on the ring I'd actually be OK with this if they took the responsibility away from the officials in enforcing this -- I'd rather go to college women's mechanics -- come out early, have captain's meeting, check the book, go back to the locker room until 3 minutes left -- and this one will never happen, IMO
19. coach is out of box and "just coaching" - first offense = warning, second offense = T; coach is out of box and behaving inappropriately - first offense = T (submitted by Mary Struckhoff)How about not worrying about the coach being out of the box when he/she is just coaching? Too much worrying about the coaching box -- just make it 28 feet and stop worrying so much about it. WHO CARES?
20. Make signal #33 (current player control signal) also used for reporting a team control foul.I'd prefer the NCAAW punch myself, but a specific signal, even the PC signal, would be good.

[All_Heart]

I like the idea of using grey jerseys because in theory I would think that the sight of the zebra stripes automatically puts negative thoughts in people's minds. Has anyone that is using grey see any difference? We are supposed to blend into the game but we wear these bright white & black striped shirts.

All these changes should be in a poll but I don't know how that would work because you can only put a max 10 options. I guess for some of the more controversial ones there could be a poll.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by All_Heart

All these changes should be in a poll but I don't know how that would work because you can only put a max 10 options. I guess for some of the more controversial ones there could be a poll.

Let's have a poll on whether we should have a poll.

[gostars]

1. 28 ft coaching box - I heard that this just barley missed passing last year. We have a 6ft box in Texas which I think is a little too small. I think 28ft. is too big. Maybe 14ft?

2. permitting gray shirt for officials - Several states already do it so we might as well make it legal. Maybe they'd start letting us wear them in Texas

3. 15 minute mark for submitting player roster and starters - I've never had the book filled out by the 10min mark. 15min is too early for HS.

4. Home team wears even numbers, visitors odd - I think this is going to cause more problems then it's going to help. Some teams just bought (or are buying) new jerseys to comply with the home wears "white not light" rule. Now there going to have to replace all there jerseys again? This is going to get real expensive and I don't think there's really much benefit.

6. eliminate closely guarded while dribbling - Not unless we get a shot clock. We shouldn't penalize good defense. IMHO closely guarded should be called more not less.

7. include a foul committed during a throw-in by the throwing team as a team control foul - Might make thinks less confusing. Would we still not change the arrow?

8. stopping the game clock on made goals in the final minute of the 4thQ and extra periods - Would make close games more exciting but you'd have to have a clock operator who's on there toes (esp. since we don't have the benefit of replay like the NCAA/NBA)

9. play in halves instead of quarters - Why? Are we going to give teams additional timeouts for the two "free" fulls they lose because of this?

10. entend the game length to 36 minutes - NO!

11. Only permitting players on the court to request a TO, head coach during a dead ball only - Having had problems before with coaches very upset I couldn't hear them in a loud gym at the end of the game this would really help.

12. eliminate lag time if officials have definite knowledge of the time YES! If I know .9 seconds came off the clock there is no logical reason I shouldn't be able to put them back on!

14. "a closely guarded count shall be terminated when the offensive player in control of the ball gets his/her head and shoulders past the defensive player."
(Mike Dick of Iowa Girls HS ath union writes of a situation in which the offensive player is cg for three seconds and then dribbles around the defender who chases the offensive player from behind but within six feet, "By current rule, the closely guarded count would continue." Hmmmm...while this clarification would be nice, it seems that someone needs to read the definition of guarding.) - Isn't this the way it's already called? This is how I understand the current rule. Maybe I'm missing something.

15. allow a shot clock by state adoption - Several states do it so we might as well make it legal.

16. court side replay for state championship games - If it's there we should be able to use it. I've had veteran officials tell me that if they had a buzzer beater that decided the state championship and there was any question, they would check a replay regardless of what the rule book said (I'm assuming they'd get UiL approval first).

18. allow pregame dunking, but not hanging on the ring - Bad idea!

19. coach is out of box and "just coaching" - first offense = warning, second offense = T; coach is out of box and behaving inappropriately - first offense = T (submitted by Mary Struckhoff) - This is how we're told to call it in Texas, although, I'm not sure it's actually a written rule.

20. Make signal #33 (current player control signal) also used for reporting a team control foul. This was a state exception in Texas this year. I'd rather get the NCAAW/NBA "punch" but that's just me.

[icallfouls]

[QUOTE=Nevadaref]
1. 28 ft coaching box - Fine
2. permitting gray shirt for officials - No big deal one way or the other
3. 15 minute mark for submitting player roster and starters - Why?
4. Home team wears even numbers, visitors odd - Just adds more expenses to the schools, and they just bought new uni's to be sure the home jerseys are white/light in color
5. require headbands/sweatbands to be same color as jersey Fine
6. eliminate closely guarded while dribbling - NO
7. include a foul committed during a throw-in by the throwing team as a team control foul - This should have been done last year
8. stopping the game clock on made goals in the final minute of the 4thQ and extra periods - lack of qualified (non-partisan) timers
9. play in halves instead of quarters - Yes
10. entend the game length to 36 minutes - Yes
11. Only permitting players on the court to request a TO, head coach during a dead ball only - I love it when a coach calls TO as his player shoots, "Tweet, time out white, no basket"
12. eliminate lag time if officials have definite knowledge of the time - Yes
13. change from a held ball to an OOB violation on the thrower when the thrower holds the ball across the boundary plane and a defender grasps it simultaneously with the thrower - Who cares?
14. "a closely guarded count shall be terminated when the offensive player in control of the ball gets his/her head and shoulders past the defensive player."
(Mike Dick of Iowa Girls HS ath union writes of a situation in which the offensive player is cg for three seconds and then dribbles around the defender who chases the offensive player from behind but within six feet, "By current rule, the closely guarded count would continue." Hmmmm...while this clarification would be nice, it seems that someone needs to read the definition of guarding.) - See def. of guarding
15. allow a shot clock by state adoption - Doesn't matter to me
16. courtside replay for state championship games - Maybe expand this to all state tournament games
17. assessing only one delay of game warning for any type of delay of game situation per team instead of one for each of the three types. - Yes
18. allow pregame dunking, but not hanging on the ring - If you can dunk, DUNK!
19. coach is out of box and "just coaching" - first offense = warning, second offense = T; coach is out of box and behaving inappropriately - first offense = T (submitted by Mary Struckhoff) - Fine by me
20. Make signal #33 (current player control signal) also used for reporting a team control foul. - Just use the NCAAW 'punch' signal, this is pretty well used, accepted, and understood already

[26 Year Gap]

I had heard there might be a change in penalty for delay in returning to the court to a violation rather than a technical, but maybe this one is not on the list of submissions. [To make it the same as leaving the court]

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by 26 Year Gap

I had heard there might be a change in penalty for delay in returning to the court to a violation rather than a technical, but maybe this one is not on the list of submissions. [To make it the same as leaving the court]

It is NOT on the list.

[Camron Rust]

Needless meddling:
2. permitting gray shirt for officials. Gives those that need something to make them look different a way to do so by moving to gray before the others do.
3. 15 minute mark for submitting player roster and starters What problem could this solve?
4. Home team wears even numbers, visitors odd. Not really a financial problem if put at a future date but not necessary.
5. require headbands/sweatbands to be same color as jersey what problem would it solve? I've never been confused by a headband color.
8. stopping the game clock on made goals in the final minute of the 4thQ and extra periods Too likely to be messed up by timers.
9. play in halves instead of quarters Why? OK, but Why?
10. entend the game length to 36 minutes How would it improve the game?
13. change from a held ball to an OOB violation on the thrower when the thrower holds the ball across the boundary plane and a defender grasps it simultaneously with the thrower
14. "a closely guarded count shall be terminated when the offensive player in control of the ball gets his/her head and shoulders past the defensive player."
(Mike Dick of Iowa Girls HS ath union writes of a situation in which the offensive player is cg for three seconds and then dribbles around the defender who chases the offensive player from behind but within six feet, "By current rule, the closely guarded count would continue." Hmmmm...while this clarification would be nice, it seems that someone needs to read the definition of guarding.) Already the rule.
16. courtside replay for state championship games can-o-worms
17. assessing only one delay of game warning for any type of delay of game situation per team instead of one for each of the three types. As rare as they are, why?
18. allow pregame dunking, but not hanging on the ring How could this improve the game?
19. coach is out of box and "just coaching" - first offense = warning, second offense = T; coach is out of box and behaving inappropriately - first offense = T (submitted by Mary Struckhoff)

Good idea:
1. 28 ft coaching box provided that the coach is coaching
7. include a foul committed during a throw-in by the throwing team as a team control foul Should have been that way already.
11. Only permitting players on the court to request a TO, head coach during a dead ball only but add that the coach could only request the timeout during a dead ball with the clock stopped.
12. eliminate lag time if officials have definite knowledge of the time
20. Make signal #33 (current player control signal) also used for reporting a team control foul.


OK with caveats6. eliminate closely guarded while dribbling Only if a shot clock were added. Don't want to see the game deteriorate from a team game to a single player putting on a dribbling exhibition.
15. allow a shot clock by state adoption Make the clock long enough to not rush too many teams...maybe 45-60 seconds.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

18. allow pregame dunking, but not hanging on the ring How could this improve the game?

Oddly enough, some fans find this entertaining. If you watch warmups before the crew comes out, many players are putting on a show anyway.

In addition, if it is legal to dunk during a game, the players should be able to practice this during warmups.

Dunking is not unsportsmanlike conduct. The actions accompanying this might be. Punish those actions.

BTW, I don't support this or oppose it. Just playing devil's advocate.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

Oddly enough, some fans find this entertaining. If you watch warmups before the crew comes out, many players are putting on a show anyway.

In addition, if it is legal to dunk during a game, the players should be able to practice this during warmups.

Dunking is not unsportsmanlike conduct. The actions accompanying this might be. Punish those actions.

BTW, I don't support this or oppose it. Just playing devil's advocate.

Well, iirc the rationale used by the FED when they initiated this rule was to guard against possible equipment damage. The rule was initiated back in the days of the fixed rims. Breakaway rims did take away a lot of the "equipment damage" concerns also. So....I guess that you can say "hmmmmmm".

Of course, I did have a backboard go on a pre-game dunk once too.......just as we were walking onto the court.

[MN BB Ref]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Needless meddling:
9. play in halves instead of quarters Why? OK, but Why?
10. entend the game length to 36 minutes How would it improve the game?

As many of you already know, in MN we went abandoned the quarter system in favor of halves this past season. In addition we went with a 36 minute game. The official reasons for this were as such:

1. Halves added more strategy by eliminating the quarter break.
2. Halves created a better flow by eliminating the quarter break.
3. By lengthening the game to 36 minutes and not adding additional timeouts, it created a need for more substituting, thus ensuring more players would have an opportunity to participate.
4. The coaches in MN supported this move.

After doing it for a season (only at the varsity level...all under varsity games were 2 halves of 16 minutes each), I must admit that I like it. The games seemed to go more quickly and it seemed like the coaches actually ended up using less timeouts than before. I don't know if it created additional playing opportunities for bench players, but it change the complexion of the game in subtle ways that didn't seem intrusive.

I'm all for making this NFHS policy, but I can also understand reluctance to ensorse this measure. To me, it makes sense because if a player goes on to college ball he/she will be playing in this system anyway, and its not as drastic of a jump to go from 36 minutes to 40 minutes in a game as it is to go from 32 minutes to 40 minutes.

Just my two cents worth.

Dave

[cmathews]

thanks for the info. With this in mind I wouldn't be against making it the new policy. Now what will we do with those unused 3's and 4's on all the scoreboards in these gyms

[mnref]

I liked the 18 min halves this past season in MN as well. Although most games had a decent and continuous flow to them, there was the one or two games where I looked up and we were in the bonus with 10 minutes left (but maybe that's my own fault )

MN also adopted the courtside replays during the televised games of the state tournaments this year...and it was used in the girls tourney to put time back on at the end of the game. The only "reviewable situations" were to count or cancel a basket near the of each half, and to add time to the clock "near the end of the game")

[26 Year Gap]

One reason I am not sure the team control situation should be present on an OOB throw-in is that the penalty for fouling in this situation is different for each team and IMO it should not be. And unless they change the definition of team control, I do not favor this change.

[jalons]

14. "a closely guarded count shall be terminated when the offensive player in control of the ball gets his/her head and shoulders past the defensive player."
(Mike Dick of Iowa Girls HS ath union writes of a situation in which the offensive player is cg for three seconds and then dribbles around the defender who chases the offensive player from behind but within six feet, "By current rule, the closely guarded count would continue." Hmmmm...while this clarification would be nice, it seems that someone needs to read the definition of guarding.)

Mr. Dick, if you didn't know, had our captain's meeting include a coin toss for the opening possession of the game during the 2003-04 and 2004-05 seasons (7th grade-Varsity). The initial possession arrow was pointed towards the loser of the coin toss. I thought there should have been a choice to "defer" if you won the toss and preferred to play defense first. If the jumper doesn't have to jump, why did the winner of the coin toss have to take the ball? However, the Iowa Girls' Union did start with the jump ball this season.

Ever wonder why we were the last state to switch from 6-on-6?