Airborne Fumble - Rule question.

[psycho_ref]

Well, if they are deliberate, then they are not fumbles.

That's like saying, 'you will see alot of deliberate airball shots being passed to one's self'. It's judgement.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

So, you're saying it's a travel to shoot the ball and catch the "rebound" before you land from the original shot?

This is exactly the same sequence of events...PC...PC lost...PC. The fact that one is a shot and the other isn't has no impact. The element that makes the rebound legal is the loss of PC. It doesn't distinguish how it is lost.

C'mon Camron, you're smarter than that. What a foolish suggestion.

4-43-3b clearly states that when an airborne player leaves the floor, the ball MUST be released on a shot or pass before he returns to the floor. If he jumps, fumbles, and returns the floor with the ball, he didn't shoot it or pass it, did it? No, I didn't think so, unless you've changed the definition of a try or a pass.

[Jurassic Referee]

I'm still waiting for our resident IAABO rules interpreter to weigh in with his learned opinion. For some reason, he seems to be avoiding telling us what his take on this one is.

You there, Chuckster?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

C'mon Camron, you're smarter than that. What a foolish suggestion.

4-43-3b clearly states that when an airborne player leaves the floor, the ball MUST be released on a shot or pass before he returns to the floor. If he jumps, fumbles, and returns the floor with the ball, he didn't shoot it or pass it, did it? No, I didn't think so, unless you've changed the definition of a try or a pass.

And as I posted much earlier in this thread that rule isn't applicable because it comes under the heading which includes "while holding the ball." The rule you are citing definitely governs the play in which the player is holding the ball the entire time. However, it is not clear that it is controlling for this scenario in which PC is lost with a fumble in mid-air.
I'm adding this to my gray area list of NFHS rules.

[radhesh]

Hmm ....
who is correct..

[ChuckElias]

Ok, I know this is an old thread but I was talking to Nevada about it just this morning, and it reminded me that there was a ruling on this printed in this year's NCAA men's basketball officiating program. I'll just type it out and you can hash out whether we should apply it to our high school games.

Play: AFter ending a dribble, A1 leaves the playing court to attempt a try for goal. While airborne, A1 fumbles the ball. A1 (a) recovers the fumble while airborne, or (b) recovers the fumble after returning to the floor. A1 dribbles the ball. The official calls a violation. Is the official correct?

Ruling: Yes. In (a) and (b) A1 is permitted to recover the ball but after recovering the ball, A1 started a second dribble. However, if a fumble is touched by another player and then recovered by A1, while airborne of after a return to the floor, A1 is allowed to start another dribble. If A1 had not previously dribbled the ball, and while airborne fumbled and recovered the ball (while airborne or after a return to the floor), he is permitted to start a dribble.

I added the emphasis in the ruling, b/c that's what we had been discussing. The rationale is clearly what Camron had argued earlier (and I hinted at). You're always allowed to recover a fumble. And since a fumble means loss of player control, it's ok to recover in the air and then land.

Now, should we use this in high school games? I don't see why not. The principle is the same in FED rules. No control, no travel. Hope that's interesting to somebody.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by He who no longer exists

blah blah blah

I thought you left?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by ChuckElias

Now, should we use this in high school games? I don't see why not.

And I don't see why.

I though that you were gonna try and get a FED ruling on this.

[OHBBREF]

Based on my understanding of the three play scenarios, A1 the dribbler can legally gain possession of the ball, (s)he can not move either foot once (s)he lands on the floor or while re-controlling the ball after landing on the floor.
(S)He can shoot, pass it to a team mate or call a TO and or hold the ball with a potential closely guarded count.

A1 muffed and or fumbled the ball.


Also, take a look at NCAA BR-82, A.R. 82. It states that once A1 returns to the floor, (s)he cannot dribble the ball again.