you make the call video

[canuckrefguy]

Originally Posted by Kostja

Forgive me, I can't stop Hopefully everybody learns something ...



Here they do.



Does airborne mean the shooter left the floor (that's how I would understand it), or does it mean, he began his shooting motion and is in the act of shooting but still on the ground?

FIBA rules allow any defender to move (laterally, backwards) into the path of the player with the ball, no matter if he is already in a shooting motion or still a dribbler. The crucial moment where all this changes is only when the player with the ball takes off (both feet leave the ground). From that point on, it is not allowed for a defender to move into his path since he can't change direction anymore.



The rule about the a player in the air does not apply here, because the defender doesn't move after the offensive player has jumped! Now, that is my judgement with the aid of multiple replays in slow motion ... My judgement can still be wrong, but I am a hundred percent sure regarding the rules (FIBA).

I still got a charge, but the more I look at it the more respect do I have for the ref who made this call and sold as if he was absolutely sure about it (even though he probably wasn't).

Oh ... I promise I will shut up now and accept whatever you "block"-guys out there say

By George, I have learned something.

I've learned that you don't referee the defense.

[NICK]

The contact was on the shoulder not the torso of the defender, therefore to me LGP was not established. I do not see any differences between Fiba rule fouls, Nba fouls, nor Ncaa fouls. You'll either get it right or get it wrong.

[Snake~eyes]

Originally Posted by NICK

The contact was on the shoulder not the torso of the defender, therefore to me LGP was not established. I do not see any differences between Fiba rule fouls, Nba fouls, nor Ncaa fouls. You'll either get it right or get it wrong.

What does the contact have to do with establishing an LGP?

[Mountaineer]

The defender has to establish LGP BEFORE the contact or it's a block. The first time I watched it I said "block". Then I watched it again - guess what - I still say "block". When you slow it down and pause it, the defender is still moving his right foot across as contact is being made. While most B/C calls are tough - I didn't think this one was all that close. The contact is also made on the left shoulder rather than the torso. I personally cannot see anyway to call it a charge. No way he travelled either, not even close on that (IMHO).

[Snake~eyes]

Everyone seems to be making a big deal out of LGP, how does the guard not have a LGP?!

[All_Heart]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer

No way he travelled either, not even close on that (IMHO).

How is it not "even close". His pivot foot is either on the ground or 1 inch off the ground when he gathers the ball. If you don't think so then that's your opinion but it is definitely close to being a travel.

[Mountaineer]

Originally Posted by All_Heart

How is it not "even close". His pivot foot is either on the ground or 1 inch off the ground when he gathers the ball. If you don't think so then that's your opinion but it is definitely close to being a travel.

If you notice I said "IMHO" - however after watching it again - I take that back. No way it's close to a walk. Yes, one foot is off the ground as he gathers the ball. By rule (4.44.2.a.2) that foot becomes the pivot foot when it touches. He can lift his pivot foot to pass or shoot. That foot does not return to the floor until after the crash. Not even close to a walk.

Not trying to be cocky or mean or anything - just stating my view of the rules. I don't think any upper level official would even consider calling that a walk when viewing that in RT. It's fun when we have video to watch and slow down and pick apart. This dude had to get it right in RT and I think he did. So did the vast majority of this post.

[All_Heart]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer

If you notice I said "IMHO" - however after watching it again - I take that back. No way it's close to a walk. Yes, one foot is off the ground as he gathers the ball. By rule (4.44.2.a.2) that foot becomes the pivot foot when it touches. He can lift his pivot foot to pass or shoot. That foot does not return to the floor until after the crash. Not even close to a walk.

This is your opinion and I respect it.

Originally Posted by Mountaineer

Not trying to be cocky or mean or anything - just stating my view of the rules. I don't think any upper level official would even consider calling that a walk when viewing that in RT. It's fun when we have video to watch and slow down and pick apart. This dude had to get it right in RT and I think he did. So did the vast majority of this post.

If you don't think the player traveled by rule then I would hope that an upper level or lower level official would not call it. But for arguments sake lets say that the player gathered the dribble with the left foot on the ground. Would you call this a travel? This type of travel happens all the time and is not called, do you dispute this? Again I don't call this travel (even though I see it all the time) because I would be one of the few officials calling it. Another travel that is hardly ever called is the spin move that post players use. A post player has the ball with the left foot as the pivot. The player spins on the right foot and brings the left foot back around. This is a travel and is hardly ever called. It has become accepted as a basketball move. I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm just pointing out the rule.