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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 02:39pm
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Injured player midway through second quarter. Player is unconscious and requires EMS. They take away player on a stretcher. There has been roughly a 20 to 30 minute game delay. Team A wants his kids to warm up and Team B says he has no problem with doing that. Referee says you have 3 minutes to warm-up. Warm-up ends and we play the remainder of the second quarter without incident.

I was under the impression that the game continued from the point of interruption and we start. Am I wrong? Just thinking of all the potential bad things that could happen? Player technical for hanging on the room during the warm-up, or you fill in the blank.

What is the proper procedure?
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 02:45pm
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Let them warm up.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 02:53pm
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Yes let them warm up. Safety first
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 02:55pm
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After just watching a kid get wheeled off the court on a stretcher, it certainly wouldn't hurt to give the kids a few minutes to get their heads back into the game and allow people some time to shift their moods back to the game. Seems like the right thing to do. All you have to do is remind the coaches that the same rules apply as for pre-game warm-ups. If anything, it's a good way to attempt to avoid a problem you might have had if you started the game as soon as the injured kid is wheeled off. Assuming he got hurt during game action, you might have a quick retaliation situation you have to deal with. It still might happen, but with a 3 minute warm-up (or cool down depending on whether tempers have flared) you may avoid a bad situation.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 03:17pm
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I would have to say no.

I did a game about 3 years ago where a cheerleader fell on her head and we had to wait for an ambulance to remove her from the court. We did not allow any warm ups at that time and we played once she was taken care of. They do not need to shoot baskets in my opinion to get warmed up. I do not find it necessary. Let the game continue and let us all move on from there. That is just my opinion. I really do not see there being a complete right or wrong issue here.

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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 03:23pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Smitty
After just watching a kid get wheeled off the court on a stretcher, it certainly wouldn't hurt to give the kids a few minutes to get their heads back into the game and allow people some time to shift their moods back to the game. Seems like the right thing to do. All you have to do is remind the coaches that the same rules apply as for pre-game warm-ups. If anything, it's a good way to attempt to avoid a problem you might have had if you started the game as soon as the injured kid is wheeled off. Assuming he got hurt during game action, you might have a quick retaliation situation you have to deal with. It still might happen, but with a 3 minute warm-up (or cool down depending on whether tempers have flared) you may avoid a bad situation.
This is a great reason to give them another couple of minutes to make sure they get revenge out of their head......hopefully.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 03:32pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
I would have to say no.

I did a game about 3 years ago where a cheerleader fell on her head and we had to wait for an ambulance to remove her from the court. We did not allow any warm ups at that time and we played once she was taken care of. They do not need to shoot baskets in my opinion to get warmed up. I do not find it necessary. Let the game continue and let us all move on from there. That is just my opinion. I really do not see there being a complete right or wrong issue here.

Peace
If BOTH coaches are OK with it, why would you argue? Let them warm up, then start the game up.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 03:39pm
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The rules only allow for "practice" between halves once the game has started (2-7-4). However, common sense indicates that a warm-up period might be prudent. The referee can allow this using his/her authority (2-3).

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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 03:57pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ref in PA
The rules only allow for "practice" between halves once the game has started (2-7-4). However, common sense indicates that a warm-up period might be prudent. The referee can allow this using his/her authority (2-3).

I think it would largely depend on the length of delay. 3-5 minutes...unnecesary...NCAA timeouts are nearly that length. 20-30 minutes and I'll let them warmup. I'm not going make my self an easy target of lawsuit if someone pulls a muscle or tears a ligament.
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Old Mon Feb 14, 2005, 04:22pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
If BOTH coaches are OK with it, why would you argue? Let them warm up, then start the game up.
I said I personally do not see a point for it. I do not care whether coaches agree or not. Coaches might agree on a lot of things and I am not going to dictate my decision based on what coaches want. That is why we all get paid the big bucks. We have to make decisions that are based on our own personal judgment. This does not mean I would not allow some type of warm up period, but I just do not see much of a point for doing it.

Peace
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Old Tue Feb 15, 2005, 09:44am
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Rut,

I don't mean to be a sore boil, but what if one of the coaches threatens you with a report to the state for disregarding player saftey? I would allow a warmup because I would hate to lose my belongings, etc., to a lawsuit that the insurance company won't cover. It's considered gross negligence.
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Old Tue Feb 15, 2005, 11:10am
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Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
I do not care whether coaches agree or not. Coaches might agree on a lot of things and I am not going to dictate my decision based on what coaches want. That is why we all get paid the big bucks. We have to make decisions that are based on our own personal judgment.
Don't we work for the coaches, kids, fans, and schools? I would think that coach input in this situation is valuable.
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Old Tue Feb 15, 2005, 11:20am
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sorry but in my opinion.. Rutledge is wrong on this one.

Is it just me or does JRutledge not want to let them warm up just so they can all know that he is the boss.

Dude sounds like Inspector Javert from the Les Miserable:
the law is the law, forget about common sense...

"They won't warm up because I said they wont warm up".
"But sir, is there a reason that they will not be allowed to warm up?"
"Because I said so!"

Yes, it is a judgement cal
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Old Tue Feb 15, 2005, 11:25am
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Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
Quote:
Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
If BOTH coaches are OK with it, why would you argue? Let them warm up, then start the game up.
I said I personally do not see a point for it. I do not care whether coaches agree or not. Coaches might agree on a lot of things and I am not going to dictate my decision based on what coaches want. That is why we all get paid the big bucks. We have to make decisions that are based on our own personal judgment. This does not mean I would not allow some type of warm up period, but I just do not see much of a point for doing it.

Peace
Im with you, I see no point in it. Also, I really dont think you are opening your self up to a lawsuit for not giving them a warm-up.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 15, 2005, 11:47am
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This is not a liability issue no more than any other decision we make. There is nothing in the rules that says to do it one way or the other.

What are you going to do if one team does not want the warm up period? I think many of you are assuming that all coaches feel it is necessary and for the same reasons and want to warm up the same way. I simply said that I do not see a major reason for shooting baskets as a warm up requirement. It also depends on how long the trainers/ambulance had to tend to the injury. There is nothing that says that while the injury is taking place that the teams could not be stretching or warming up in other ways. You do not have to give players times to shoot baskets to be warm. I have done many football games that had delays based on injury and weather and that did not mean the players went out and did kicking drills to warm up. They stretched on the field as a team in one corner. Even then not all coaches agree with what they should do and how it should be done. In a perfect world all coaches and players agree. In the real world they do not agree for very different reasons. Some teams want to get out their and try to maintain their momentum, what is left of it. Some teams might not want the other team to practice getting their shot back. The only people here are assuming what coaches are going to want are a bunch of officials that seem to not live in a world where things do not go so perfect. At the end of the day that is our decision as referees to decide what to do. It is not the choice of the coaches. Sometimes the AD might have a say that goes completely against what the coaches want.

If you are in constant fear of being sued, then get out of officiating. Seriously get out right now. Even if you allow a warm up period, someone could say you did not give them enough time to their satisfaction. You might give the teams 3 minutes and one coach wanted 10. You are never going to make everyone happy or do everything that others will agree with. I can tell you from my Baseball, Football and Basketball experience, there are situations that not everyone can agree on. Just this past Football season in my first round playoff game, the coaches could not agree one what they wanted to do as a warm-up period for weather delays. One coach had one thing in mind. The other coach had another issue. Guess who made the final decision?

Peace
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