Varsity fast track

[Tim Roden]

Peter, NF and NCAA rules both state that the game is over when we leave the visual confines of the floor. Even if we sign the book, the game is not over until we leave. So to get off the floor as quickly as possible is not just for our sake but for the sake of the game. The winner cannot official celibrate until we officially leave.:-) BTW, I have never signed a book after the horn. I always start the game by signing the book at the 10 minute mark.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by JRutledge
... do not stick around to shake hands and give autographys, that is for sure.

But Rut, when they ask me to sign the game ball, they are so sweet and sincere! Do I have to say no!?!?

And the fan that wins the raffle for the ref-autographed ball is always complimentary and courteous, too. I hate to disappoint them!

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by Tim Roden
Peter, NF and NCAA rules both state that the game is over when we leave the visual confines of the floor. Even if we sign the book, the game is not over until we leave.

Is this a new one this year? I thought game ended upon approval, and leaving was construed as a form of approval.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by rainmaker

But Rut, when they ask me to sign the game ball, they are so sweet and sincere! Do I have to say no!?!?

And the fan that wins the raffle for the ref-autographed ball is always complimentary and courteous, too. I hate to disappoint them!

[commish]

As a commissioner I find it interesting that "the" subject among non-varsity officials is the "plot" by varsity officials to keep them away from varsity action. I am the commissioner for 15 high schools and working at the varsity level depends on your ability, your attitude, and taking advantage of an opportunity when given one. Male - female makes no difference to me. I currently assign approximately 20 women to varsity games. Of these 20, 3 (all under 30 years old)also work boy's varsity. Of these 3, 1 (age 27 - but 9 years of experience and the first woman in our state to work a State Championship game) works any varsity game I have. Finally, and young officials do not like to hear this, experience is a huge factor in assigning. Getting better every time out is what is important, along with a great attitude. e.g. after working your sub-varsity game do you go home or do you watch the varsity game?

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Mark Dexter

Is this a new one this year? I thought game ended upon approval, and leaving was construed as a form of approval.

An editorial change was made this year to reflect the true desire of the Committee. The jurisdiction of the officials' is terminated AND the final score has been approved when the referee leaves the visual confines of the playing area. A question on last year's Part 1 exam made the Committe realize that, the way the rule was worded, the jurisdiction actually ended when the score was approved, even if the officials were still on the floor.

Incidentally, in NC, we sign the book before the game.

[rainmaker]

I've had partners tell me to sign the book before the game, but I feel uncomfortable with that. Does my signature give my stamp of approval to the book? If I sign before hand, am I certifying what isn't even there yet? Or just indicating that in fact it was me that worked?

[Peter Devana]

Hey guys,
I never thought you ever had to sign the book in NCAA rules. What's the point of signing anything prior to the contest?- In FIBA your signature approved the final score and the game was not officially over until the ref signed it -The point I tried to make is that I can't see why the officials have to run off as soon as the buzzer sounds-I think the should leave in the same way as they arrived -Together and in a Dignified manner. I have seen D1 officials run off in three different directions following a game and it really makes them look like they are not too happy with how they performed and they better get while the getting is good. Do they really think they have done that poorly in EVERY game?? Are the officials instructed to run off in other sports??-I have officiated half a dozen different sports and cannot recall this ever happening Except in Basketball and only in the past 10 years.
In my opinion it makes the officials appear weak.
Pistol

[JRutledge]

I really do not see your point. Why would you want to stick around? Especially in basketball, you might have a couple thousand people angry with you. You want to stick around so they can confront you or attack you? I know in football we do not stick around very long, many times we run off the field in that sport too. It is much easier to get into some kind of confrontation when you are getting off the court slowly. The point is, do not give them a chance.

Originally posted by Peter Devana
Hey guys,
I never thought you ever had to sign the book in NCAA rules. What's the point of signing anything prior to the contest?- In FIBA your signature approved the final score and the game was not officially over until the ref signed it -The point I tried to make is that I can't see why the officials have to run off as soon as the buzzer sounds-I think the should leave in the same way as they arrived -Together and in a Dignified manner. I have seen D1 officials run off in three different directions following a game and it really makes them look like they are not too happy with how they performed and they better get while the getting is good. Do they really think they have done that poorly in EVERY game?? Are the officials instructed to run off in other sports??-I have officiated half a dozen different sports and cannot recall this ever happening Except in Basketball and only in the past 10 years.
In my opinion it makes the officials appear weak.
Pistol

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by rainmaker
I've had partners tell me to sign the book before the game, but I feel uncomfortable with that. Does my signature give my stamp of approval to the book? If I sign before hand, am I certifying what isn't even there yet? Or just indicating that in fact it was me that worked?

You're not certifying anything Juulie. You're just indicating who the officials are who work the game.

In NC, we are required by the NCHSAA to write the names of the officials who working the game in both team's scorebooks. If we don't, it's a $25 fine.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Peter Devana
Hey guys,
I never thought you ever had to sign the book in NCAA rules. What's the point of signing anything prior to the contest?- In FIBA your signature approved the final score and the game was not officially over until the ref signed it -The point I tried to make is that I can't see why the officials have to run off as soon as the buzzer sounds-I think the should leave in the same way as they arrived -Together and in a Dignified manner. I have seen D1 officials run off in three different directions following a game and it really makes them look like they are not too happy with how they performed and they better get while the getting is good. Do they really think they have done that poorly in EVERY game?? Are the officials instructed to run off in other sports??-I have officiated half a dozen different sports and cannot recall this ever happening Except in Basketball and only in the past 10 years.
In my opinion it makes the officials appear weak.
Pistol

You make it sound like we're running off the floor like three chickens with our heads chopped off. That's not the case. You can leave the floor in a dignified manner without taking a stroll in the park.

Most officials work high school ball, not NCAA ball. In my post to Juulie, you can read that we are required to indicate in each scorebook that's at the table, the names of the officials who are working the game. We don't have to certify the game in writing. Does FIBA not trust the coaches and administrators to properly report the results of the game? Why is it necessary to sign a book and say this is what happened?

Our state association also requires the schools to provide security for all varsity soccer, football and basketball officials when they leave the field. We are to get our butts off the field and out of possible harm's way as oon as possible. Perhaps things are much more cozy up north. But down here, it's a sign of the times that we live in. There are too many crazies in the world to risk a confronatation over a ballgame.

Happy New Year, Peter!

[JoeD1]

Peter, I don't know if things are different up there in B.C. but here things can get really bad really quick.

About two weeks ago I was running the clock at a local varsity game. This two schools are big rivals so the gym was packed. At the end of the 4th home team down by 2 with 6sec remaining they inbound the ball and throw up a quick three, he misses but the ball hits the back iron and bounces straight up,when the ball comes down one of the home players tips the ball in just as the buzzer went off. The officials waved off the shot and hurried out the door, good thing they did because as soon as they ranout the door abouta dozen partly full coke bottles came flying onto the court. Now imagine what would have happened if they had to sign the book after the game!!

(by the way, looked like a great call)

[Peter Devana]

I quess things are verry different up here-Thank God!!! In close games we always verify that the score is correct before we leave-if it isn't we may have to play an OT- thats precisely why the ref is supposed to check- you can't correct it once you have left the floor according to NCAA rules. On wide spread scores the requirement is far less and a simple thumbs up to the scorer is usually all thats required and you can leave much quicker. If things are as bad as most of you indicate down south then I do agree with your procedure but the rules should be changed so that you are not held responsible for approving the final score.

[JRutledge]

this is Basketball, not Junior Hockey. You will get killed doing that in a basketball game.

What rules do you go under up there, because I know of no rule that states you sign the book afterwards to approve the score.

[Tim Roden]

In close games, we almost always have a T.O. in the last minute. This is a good place to check the books so that when the game finishes and you see 71-70, you can get out of dodge.