Block or Charge? Non-torso contact

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by tnolan

These types of plays can sometimes be difficult to judge, IMHO.
Possible legal defender and the offensive player changes direction via a euro-step and makes contact with the defender outside the torso, normally with the shoulder. Defender falls to the ground and the offensive player flails away and puts up an attempt/shot.
What do you have?

I try not to read too deep into the rule book and there are so many different philosophies on block/charges that come into this mix.
Referee the defense
What did the defender do wrong?
Players don't have to "take" a charge
Offensive initiated contact (OIC)
Torso contact for charges, shoulder contact blocks

And obviously the defense can move (not forward) as long as they're essentially not undercutting the shooters start for the attempt. But what about the offense? They have the onus to avoid contact by stopping or changing direction, in order to try to get their body past the torso of the defender. So, does the attempt to change direction and OIC into the shoulder of a legal defender change this call in either way?

Seems as though this contact ends up in block calls the majority of the time, at most/all levels. I'd be interested to hear everyone's thoughts on this call, these theories, and our never ending battle for call consistency across the world/nation/state/chapter.

What causes the officials being fooled into calling some of these blocks is the defender flopping from the minimal contact. We have offensive players that are spinning away from the defender or changing directions and there is minimal contact to the shoulder and the defender throws himself backward like they've been hit by Ronnie Lott. Since we know the contact should not have created that reaction, the defense loses the benefit of the doubt.

I've seen a lot of plays on video this season where players embellishing contact actually works against them. Had a game this season where we twice missed illegal by a defender into the legs of a ballhandler because the ballhandler threw his head back distracting our concentration from the point of contact.

I had a play last week where a defender bumps a ballhandler from behind and I call a foul. I look at the video and the contact was incidental, but because the defender threw his head back like it was a big collision, I thought the contact was more severe than it actually was.

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by Raymond

What causes the officials being fooled into calling some of these blocks is the defender flopping from the minimal contact. We have offensive players that are spinning away from the defender or changing directions and there is minimal contact to the shoulder and the defender throws himself backward like they've been hit by Ronnie Lott. Since we know the contact should not have created that reaction, the defense loses the benefit of the doubt.

I've seen a lot of plays on video this season where players embellishing contact actually works against them. Had a game this season where we twice missed illegal by a defender into the legs of a ballhandler because the ballhandler threw his head back distracting our concentration from the point of contact.

I had a play last week where a defender bumps a ballhandler from behind and I call a foul. I look at the video and the contact was incidental, but because the defender threw his head back like it was a big collision, I thought the contact was more severe than it actually was.

I agree. That's why a flop warning in high school basketball is overdue. It has eliminated much of the tomfoolery in men's college games around flopping, does not cost anything, and has a clear progression of penalties. If officials are willing to use the official flop warning early and often, teams will get the message.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

... defender throws himself backward like they've been hit by Ronnie Lott. Since we know the contact should not have created that reaction, the defense loses the benefit of the doubt ... I've seen a lot of plays on video this season where players embellishing contact actually works against them ... the ballhandler threw his head back distracting our concentration from the point of contact ... because the defender threw his head back like it was a big collision, I thought the contact was more severe than it actually was.

Realistic officiating by a very experienced basketball official.

Pay attention young'uns and everybody else.