Clock and Lights don't match up. Buzzer Beater.

[Freddy]

2-12-7, "If a red/LED light is used, the light is the official expiration of playing time."
So, is it our responsibility to confirm what some perceive to be an equipment malfunction? Or do we "call it by the light", and "call it by the horn" if no light, then let others sort it out later whether or not the system wasn't was not right? Does "clock malfunctioned" clause in 5-10-2 give us the task of ruling according to whatever technical knowledge we can bring to bear on the situation for which we have no video review?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Freddy

2-12-7, "If a red/LED light is used, the light is the official expiration of playing time."
So, is it our responsibility to confirm what some perceive to be an equipment malfunction? Or do we "call it by the light", and "call it by the horn" if no light, then let others sort it out later whether or not the system wasn't was not right? Does "clock malfunctioned" clause in 5-10-2 give us the task of ruling according to whatever technical knowledge we can bring to bear on the situation for which we have no video review?

Call it by the light, unless it's obvious on the court that the light was "late" / malfunctioning -- and, based on the descriptions in this thread I don't think its the case (I didn't watch the video)

[JRutledge]

I want to know what "knowing who the officials were" has to do with anything? I cannot speak for them, but in our state the host school always knows who the officials are before the contests and if that means almost nothing. And there are sites in my state that self-report our assignments. So anyone can know if you do enough research.

Peace

[LRZ]

"I want to know what 'knowing who the officials were' has to do with anything?"

Translated: "Who can I blame?"

[BoomerSooner]

When discussing conflict of the video showing 0.0 and the light not being on, there are a couple of things to consider.

First is that the clock only reads tenths of a second, so from a precision standpoint, we have to accept that the clock is only 100% accurate for a small percentage of the game. Most timing systems change once there is anything less than the amount of time previously shown on the clock. For example, when the clock is initially started at the beginning of a quarter, it immediately switches to 7:59, although in reality in the instant the clock is started the actual time remaining in the quarter is closer to 8:00 than it is to 7:59. In fact that is the case for the first half second of each quarter. Mathematically this same principle applies to the last 0.1 of a game as well. On a clock that reads only tenths of a second, it will show 0.0 once there is less than 0.1 on the clock, although the clock is still technically closer to 0.1 (0.09) than 0.0.

The second thing to consider is the quality of the video in terms of frames per second (fps). If the video was recorded at 30fps (reasonable to assume it would be in this ballpark), each frame would be .0333 seconds, and thus the final 0.1 of the game would be comprised of at least 3 frames if timing of the first frame of the last 0.1 synced up with exactly with when the clock changed. In all likelihood, this would not be the case and there would be parts 4 different frames covering the last 0.1 seconds. With that in mind, the point is that you have to look at the right frame to actually capture the end of the game. There will be multiple frames that will show 0.0 on the clock but in actuality there will still be hundredths/thousandths of a second left.

This is the long, math-based explanation for why even with video replay, the light should be used to determine when the game has ended.

[BillyMac]

Anybody want to set the clock at ten seconds and run it down to see if the light'horn/clock malfunctions again?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BoomerSooner

When discussing conflict of the video showing 0.0 and the light not being on, there are a couple of things to consider.

First is that the clock only reads tenths of a second, so from a precision standpoint, we have to accept that the clock is only 100% accurate for a small percentage of the game. Most timing systems change once there is anything less than the amount of time previously shown on the clock. For example, when the clock is initially started at the beginning of a quarter, it immediately switches to 7:59, although in reality in the instant the clock is started the actual time remaining in the quarter is closer to 8:00 than it is to 7:59. In fact that is the case for the first half second of each quarter. Mathematically this same principle applies to the last 0.1 of a game as well. On a clock that reads only tenths of a second, it will show 0.0 once there is less than 0.1 on the clock, although the clock is still technically closer to 0.1 (0.09) than 0.0.

The second thing to consider is the quality of the video in terms of frames per second (fps). If the video was recorded at 30fps (reasonable to assume it would be in this ballpark), each frame would be .0333 seconds, and thus the final 0.1 of the game would be comprised of at least 3 frames if timing of the first frame of the last 0.1 synced up with exactly with when the clock changed. In all likelihood, this would not be the case and there would be parts 4 different frames covering the last 0.1 seconds. With that in mind, the point is that you have to look at the right frame to actually capture the end of the game. There will be multiple frames that will show 0.0 on the clock but in actuality there will still be hundredths/thousandths of a second left.

This is the long, math-based explanation for why even with video replay, the light should be used to determine when the game has ended.

Long explanation, but not really right. There was a very perceptable delay between the clock, the horn, and the LED lights....nothing that could be explained by rounding. Plus, your understanding of the clocks is not generally correct. Most modern game clocks will only show 0.0 when it is truly 0. They started to change a long time ago exactly for situations like this.

[rbruno]

Always felt that LED lights are great but how can you see the shooter and lights at the same time. A least going by the buzzer you can stay with the shooter and make a judgement based on what you see and when you hear the horn

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by rbruno

Always felt that LED lights are great but how can you see the shooter and lights at the same time. A least going by the buzzer you can stay with the shooter and make a judgement based on what you see and when you hear the horn

A lot of the time you can see the light. Just like anything it depends on where the official is and the ball. But it is not usually totally out of sight by the calling official or someone on the crew. It is harder to see the clock if the clock is never anywhere else but on the wall or ceiling.

Peace