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  #31 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 01, 2020, 03:18pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
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Originally Posted by youngump View Post
Has the official in question? Suppressing coach speech to improve the perception of the state of officiating is a dangerous game. ...
Have you ever considered that conferences, which are run by conference commissioners at the behest of the schools' presidents, have rules regarding the media which their coaches are expected to follow?

So even if an official gets a judgement call wrong, the coach is probably not allowed to go to the media and blast that official by name.

Have you also considered that there are protocols in place for coaches to follow when they want to address an officiating issue?

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 01, 2020, 08:59pm
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Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
Have you also considered that there are protocols in place for coaches to follow when they want to address an officiating issue?

I’m assuming he has also failed to consider (or doesn’t know) that NCAA officials are evaluated on all games at every level.

The fact that actions have consequences cuts both ways.



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  #33 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 01, 2020, 09:04pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
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Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
I abso-f******-lutely hate the stupid "don't compound a missed call with a technical foul" nonsense.

Sorry, but coaches and players don't get to do whatever they want just because they may have a legitimate beef.
The official in question probably does not think they got the play wrong. So that is stupid when I hear what we are to allow certain behavior when you have not seen the video.

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  #34 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 01, 2020, 09:17pm
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
The official in question probably does not think they got the play wrong. So that is stupid when I hear what we are to allow certain behavior when you have not seen the video.

I agree. But even if we do think we got the play wrong (we’re not robots, after all), a certain level of decorum must be maintained. I’ll give a coach or player a little extra rope in that scenario, but when the toddler temper tantrum or a magic word or two are unleashed, I have to address it.



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  #35 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 01, 2020, 09:20pm
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Originally Posted by crosscountry55 View Post
I agree. But even if we do think we got the play wrong (we’re not robots, after all), a certain level of decorum must be maintained. I’ll give a coach or player a little extra rope in that scenario, but when the toddler temper tantrum or a magic word or two are unleashed, I have to address it.
And we do not know what was said and by whom. It appeared to be an assistant coach and those guys get very little rope to react anyway.

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  #36 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 02:59pm
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
The official in question probably does not think they got the play wrong. So that is stupid when I hear what we are to allow certain behavior when you have not seen the video.

Peace
A good point I forgot to include. If he did not believe he missed the call then it's not possible for him to "compound" his mistake, if you buy into that phony line of thinking.

I have had many plays that I thought I got right in real time only to watch the film and realize I was incorrect. Some of those decisions preceded a well-deserved technical foul, but that doesn't mean I "compounded" my mistake that I didn't even know I made at the time.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 03:02pm
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Originally Posted by crosscountry55 View Post
I’m assuming he has also failed to consider (or doesn’t know) that NCAA officials are evaluated on all games at every level.

The fact that actions have consequences cuts both ways.



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Maybe in Division 1, but at the D2 and D3 you aren't getting an eval every night. Still, even at those levels there aren't any conferences that will allow coaches to do what Brey did without some type of repercussion. And there is good reason for that on top of the fact that there are procedures in place for coaches to voice their displeasure internally.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 04:13pm
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Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
Maybe in Division 1, but at the D2 and D3 you aren't getting an eval every night. Still, even at those levels there aren't any conferences that will allow coaches to do what Brey did without some type of repercussion. And there is good reason for that on top of the fact that there are procedures in place for coaches to voice their displeasure internally.
It has become common that you are getting videos at those levels. I get more college game videos than I ever got working high school games. So the evaluation is increasing, but certainly not what D1 guys can get. But I can look at my plays at that level and figure out what I screwed up (if the angle is good).

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  #39 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 08:48pm
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Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
Have you ever considered that conferences, which are run by conference commissioners at the behest of the schools' presidents, have rules regarding the media which their coaches are expected to follow?

So even if an official gets a judgement call wrong, the coach is probably not allowed to go to the media and blast that official by name.

Have you also considered that there are protocols in place for coaches to follow when they want to address an officiating issue?

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Did you read my post? I've not only considered that; I was stating rather explicitly my objection to such policies.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 08:51pm
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Originally Posted by crosscountry55 View Post
I’m assuming he has also failed to consider (or doesn’t know) that NCAA officials are evaluated on all games at every level.

The fact that actions have consequences cuts both ways.



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Why would you make that assumption? I've definitely considered how that affects it and still think the benefits of an enforced silence policy(*) are outweighed by it's cost.

(*) Or an enforced dishonesty policy as the case may be.
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 08:59pm
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Originally Posted by youngump View Post
Did you read my post? I've not only considered that; I was stating rather explicitly my objection to such policies.
Well, apparently the folks who run the college conferences across the country have different expectations and standards in regards to its coaches. I'm glad they do.

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  #42 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 09:00pm
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Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
A good point I forgot to include. If he did not believe he missed the call then it's not possible for him to "compound" his mistake, if you buy into that phony line of thinking.

I have had many plays that I thought I got right in real time only to watch the film and realize I was incorrect. Some of those decisions preceded a well-deserved technical foul, but that doesn't mean I "compounded" my mistake that I didn't even know I made at the time.
You're conflating the notion of whether you made a second mistake with whether your mistake was compounded. If you miss a foul call, the mistake is compounded if that player is in foul trouble. That doesn't mean you made a worse mistake.
If the technical that follows is obvious, then that's one thing. If it's borderline and you weren't sure that's another.

(In another sport, I've thrown a coach where I was quite sure I was wrong but couldn't fix it. That definitely compounded my mistake but throwing him wasn't a mistake as he took that choice out of my hands.)
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 09:03pm
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Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
Well, apparently the folks who run the college conferences across the country have different expectations and standards in regards to its coaches. I'm glad they do.

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And I'm not glad because I think the benefits are outweighed by the costs.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 09:04pm
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Originally Posted by youngump View Post
...the point remains that in this case this call WAS compounded by a technical.
So at that moment, the official knew he got the play wrong and should have tolerated inappropriate comments or behavior from the bench personnel?



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  #45 (permalink)  
Old Sun Feb 02, 2020, 09:14pm
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Originally Posted by youngump View Post
And I'm not glad because I think the benefits are outweighed by the costs.
Maybe one day you'll be in a position to affect that change. But I'm thinking scholastic administrators just simply don't want their coaches bad-mouthing officials in the press.

I guess you're also in favor of officials publicly commenting about coaches and institutions by name?

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