Incorrect administration of free throw (inadvertent horn)

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Billy, You cannot allow the FT to attempt and if he misses give him another try because of the horn. That would be unfair to the opposing team, which didn't do anything wrong. Either allow play to continue and the result of the attempt stands or whistle it dead immediately and deal with the horn, then come back and readminister the FT.

In the original post the horn sounded, seconds passed, and then, undistracted, the shooter shot the free throw.

No reattempt here if he misses.

However, if the horn sounds simultaneously while the shooter is in the act of shooting, and the ball is released before I can whistle it dead, I will consider giving him a another try.

To not do so would be unfair to the rattled shooter, who didn't do anything wrong.

I can penalize a defensive player on the lane making a loud sound while the shooter is in the act of shooting by calling a delayed violation.

I can't penalize the table crew for sounding the horn at the same instant that the shooter is in the act of shooting, releasing it before I can whistle it dead, but I can as sure as hell give him another try if he misses.

One thing I want to stay away from is sounding my whistle after the release, but before the make/miss.

Either way, one coach is going to be pissed off.

"He missed it, how can you give him another one?"

"He made it, how can you not count it?"

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

In the original post the horn sounded, seconds passed, and then, undistracted, the shooter shot the free throw.



No reattempt here if he misses.



However, if the horn sounds simultaneously while the shooter is in the act of shooting, and the ball is released before I can whistle it dead, I will consider giving him a another try.



To not do so would be unfair to the shooter, who didn't do anything wrong. I can penalize a defensive player on the lane making a loud sound while the shooter is in the act of shooting by calling a delayed violation.



I can't penalize the table crew for sounding the horn at the same instant that the shooter is in the act of shooting, releasing it before I can whistle it dead, but I can as sure as hell give him another try if he misses.

If the horn sounds, I'm getting the ball back from the shooter and readministering.


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[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Rich

If the horn sounds, I'm getting the ball back from the shooter and readministering.

Agree. I would also get the ball back from the shooter, if I could.

I'm saying that the ball is released a split second after the horn sounds, too late to get it back from the rattled shooter because it's on it's way to the hoop.

Unless the ball has an rubber band attached to it (à la Harlem Globetrotters), no chance that we're getting it back from the rattled shooter.

This is a much different situation from the original post where a few seconds passed.

[Jay R]

I like to do like Joe Crawford and run to block his attempt before he can release it. 😉

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Jay R

I like to do like Joe Crawford and run to block his attempt before he can release it.

If it works, go for it.

https://youtu.be/204gY7HLqXc

[MattReferee]

Let’s remember that we as official control what happens on the floor and our whistle not a inadvertent horn play on !!
Haven’t you been in the situation after a made free-throw”last FT”or made baskets and you have your five second count and you have a substitution at the table and table hits horn 🤭
Do you give the player throwing ball in a few more second because of HORN? Or isn’t it PLAY on ?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by MattReferee

... isn’t it PLAY on?

If I can get through the situation with no advantage or disadvantage to either team, I'll yell. "Play", but if I have any indication that the horn will have an adverse effect on anyone, I'll blow it dead.

In my game, with my table crew, I'm not going to allow my horn to screw up any of my players.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Unless the ball has an rubber band attached to it (à la Harlem Globetrotters), no chance that we're getting it back from the rattled shooter.

https://youtu.be/Wqtv0p8YtTk

While I was searching for the Harlem Globetrotters rubber band trick, I came across another Harlem Globetrotters free throw trick that I had never seen before, there's very little chance we're getting this ball back to readminister:

https://youtu.be/p2I3XJ6nqSY

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Either way, one coach is going to be pissed off.

"He missed it, how can you give him another one?"

"He made it, how can you not count it?"

It's the home school's fault. Make that coach mad.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

It's the home school's fault. Make that coach mad.

Holiday tournament. Neutral court.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Holiday tournament. Neutral court.

Give the other coach "two-to-make-one" at the other end on the next FT attempt.

[bucky]

What am I missing? So the table caused the horn to sound. That has nothing to do with the game AFAIAC. I am not familiar with any rule application. The title of the post said it all "inadvertent." Everything is live and all should continue playing. Addressing the horn after the shot is acceptable but why wave off the first make? What was the table's/ref's explanation for not counting the first FT? Yes, there are lots of things to do to prevent this or even do differently, time permitting, but if there is a horn then immediate shot, who cares? Even if many, but not all, players stopped, who cares, tell them to play.

I find it hard to believe Billy that you would award another shot if the first was missed. You would not do the same if some spectator yelled. By rule, or lack thereof, would you not consider the horn to be treated in the same way?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

I find it hard to believe Billy that you would award another shot if the first was missed. You would not do the same if some spectator yelled. By rule, or lack thereof, would you not consider the horn to be treated in the same way?

Correct, I would not readminister for a spectator deliberately trying to distract the shooter because, for some reason, that has become accepted behavior, that is mostly out of the control of the officials and more under the control of the game administrators.

The table crew, on the other hand, is under the jurisdiction of the rules, and thus, the game officials, and should act in a neutral manner, in much the same way as the game officials. While the distracting action of the table crew may be innocent and unintentional, it is still distracting, and needs to be remedied (if the horn and release occur near simultaneously).

I've worked games where the action near the end of a period is so intense that I may lose track of the remaining time such that when the horn sounds unexpectedly it scares the bejesus out of me.

I'm not going to expect a kid to maintain his concentration and make his "unhindered" free throw under the same circumstances.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Correct, I would not readminister for a spectator deliberately trying to distract the shooter because, for some reason, that has become accepted behavior, that is mostly out of the control of the officials and more under the control of the game administrators.

The table crew, on the other hand, in under the jurisdiction of the rules, and thus, the game officials, and should act in a neutral manner, in much the same way as the game officials. While the distracting action of the table crew may be innocent and unintentional, it is still distracting, and needs to be remedied (if the horn and release occur near simultaneously).

I've worked games where the action near the end of a period is so intense that I may lose track of the remaining time such that when the horn sounds unexpectedly it scares the bejesus out of me.

I'm not going to expect a kid to maintain his concentration and make his "unhindered" free throw under the same circumstances.

I can dig it. Indeed, better go all out and do a Joey Crawford when you hear that horn.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I'm not going to expect a kid to maintain his concentration and make his "unhindered" free throw under the same circumstances.