Shooter landing on defender laying on floor

[thedewed]

boy I don't know. It's a pretty well accepted principle of the game that if you are on defense, and a ball possessor contacts you, you better be in LGP or you risk a foul call. You've got to be aware of where the ball is and square up. If you've got your back to the ball and get run into, it's on you, is the way I've always understood it. And that works.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by thedewed

boy I don't know. It's a pretty well accepted principle of the game that if you are on defense, and a ball possessor contacts you, you better be in LGP or you risk a foul call. You've got to be aware of where the ball is and square up. If you've got your back to the ball and get run into, it's on you, is the way I've always understood it. And that works.

That (pretty much all of your post) can't be further from the truth. If you're calling it that way, you're giving players fouls that don't deserve them in a lot of cases and are guilty of perpetuating incorrect information.

[thedewed]

Okay, how about a defensive player standing with his arms out and a dribbler runs into the outstretched arm, no foul? The defensive player was standing there like a statue. If an offensive player with the ball comes in contact with a defensive player that is not in legal guarding position, the responsibility for the contact is on the defensive player. Can someone stand like a statue with his back to a ball handler in front of the basket and take a charge? No. Why not if you are correct?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by thedewed

Can someone stand like a statue with his back to a ball handler in front of the basket and take a charge?

Yes.

[thedewed]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Yes.

Wow. Never seen it, never will. That's crazy. So explain what the point of lgp even is? That is simply not the way the game is called.

[Altor]

Originally Posted by thedewed

Wow. Never seen it, never will. That's crazy. So explain what the point of lgp even is? That is simply not the way the game is called.

LGP grants the defense extra privileges in addition to the right to a spot on the floor (provided he gets there first and legally). Namely, LGP allows the defender to move laterally and backwards to maintain LGP.

[thedewed]

No official in their right mind is going to not call a block on a player in front of the basket with his back to the basket If a driver makes contact with him. Good luck with that.

[bob jenkins]

[QUOTE=thedewed;1027428] So explain what the point of lgp even is? /quote]

To allow additional movement by the defender that would otherwise be illegal.

That is simply not the way the game is called.

As a practical matter, that's mainly true -- because very few defenders actually are standing still, or moving in the same path and direction as the offensive player. But, if you pay attention, you will see collisions between payers (whether the offensive player has the ball or not) that are properly judged to be "nothing"

[LRZ]

thedewed, you really ought to read (or re-read) the definitions in Rule 4 about guarding and arms and hands, and the contact section of Rule 10. Please note this line, which says nothing about LGP being a prerequisite: "Every player is entitled to a spot on the playing court provided such player gets there first without illegally contacting an opponent."

Maybe you should talk this over with some experienced officials you respect.

[Pantherdreams]

The player with the arm out is trying to hold space they are not entitled to with their arm. So if the dribbler goes through their arm, AND if the contact has a significant and immediate impact on the offensive player then you can call a foul.

The player standing still backward is entitled to the spot they are holding and are protected from being run into and run over just because of where they choose to stand.

The debate here if you wanted to have one is whether or not a player on the ground can occupy all that space and have it called their's. Back turned, on one leg, sitting, standings, lying down. Players still need and are entitled to a space of their own free from opposing teams running roughshod into/through them.

If a player is not in LGP position to help on the ball carrier, so the ball carrier chooses to jump into their shoulder or side that does not mean that the stationary defender (who has the offense playing pin ball) should or will get a foul called against them.

[CJP]

Originally Posted by thedewed

boy I don't know. It's a pretty well accepted principle of the game that if you are on defense, and a ball possessor contacts you, you better be in LGP or you risk a foul call. You've got to be aware of where the ball is and square up. If you've got your back to the ball and get run into, it's on you, is the way I've always understood it. And that works.

Officials who think a player has to be "set" to take a charge would probably agree with you. It seems that there is still officials who think that this is a "principle" of the game as well.