Wanted, Reward, Dead Or Alive ...

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by sdoebler

At least working with the relevant parties on scheduling prior to the season allowed them to avoid all the changes.

I guess that was my point. Normally officials are an afterthought for schools until something goes wrong, but the shortage must be getting so dire in some places that schools have to be proactive in scheduling around when officials will be most available.

I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

[sdoebler]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I guess that was my point. Normally officials are an afterthought for schools until something goes wrong, but the shortage must be getting so dire in some places that schools have to be proactive in scheduling around when officials will be most available.

I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

We have about 6 assignors for our area, it was mostly the smaller and charter schools that were left out. This is probably for two reasons.

1. Lower profile games which may make them theoretically easier to move
2. Our process is different from most as I understand it. We receive all of our games for the entire season from the draw on or about October 31st. Many of the smaller schools don't get their schedule in in time to be part of the process so the officials for these schools are assigned manually with what is left. All of the games and officials are ranked so the higher ranked games will be filled first till there is no qualified referees left.

[ilyazhito]

Interesting. It certainly helps to have a degree of certainty as to who does what games, but how does your area deal with turnbacks, transfer officials, and dual-level officials (High School and College)? IMO, I might only know for sure what my availability is for the next month, unless there are set dates that I need to be present for (e.g. association/state meetings) or I cannot work on (e.g. the day before a final exam), and scheduling me for the entire season might lead to awkward situations in that regard. If the entire schedule is set in advance, then transfer officials might not have as much of a chance to get games compared to established officials, simply because the assigners have not seen them work, or may not know about them, other than through references from former associations.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

If the entire schedule is set in advance ...

After being a Forum member for thirteen years, it is my understanding that some officials sign contracts anywhere from eighteen months, to twenty four months, in advance.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

After being a Forum member for thirteen years, it is my understanding that some officials sign contracts anywhere from eighteen months, to twenty four months, in advance.

Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

In my state there are many schools that probably don't even have their schedules finalized for the impending season. Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here, 1-2 weeks for subvarsity. I wouldn't want to get games much earlier than that; there are too many things that can change with respect to my availability.

When in Rome...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here ...

Same here in my little corner of Connecticut.

Now.

Back in the Ancient Days before computers, the internet, email, and Arbiter, we were assigned games through "snail mail" delivered by the United States Postal Service. We mailed (not email) in our availability calendar (it was an actual physical calendar) in September/October, and received our assignments for the entire season a few weeks before the season began. Turnbacks, and reschedules, were handled by Ma Bell's land line telephones, some with rotary dials (Goggle it young'uns). Somehow, it worked. It worked for our assigner, and it worked for us. Hard to believe, but it's true.

Now I have to go out shopping for a new buggy whip.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Same here in my little corner of Connecticut.

Now.

Back in the Ancient Days before computers, the internet, email, and Arbiter, we were assigned games through "snail mail" delivered by the United States Postal Service. We mailed (not email) in our availability calendar (it was an actual physical calendar) in September/October, and received our assignments for the entire season a few weeks before the season began. Turnbacks, and reschedules, were handled by Ma Bell's land line telephones, some with rotary dials (Goggle it young'uns). Somehow, it worked. It worked for our assigner, and it worked for us. Hard to believe, but it's true.

Now I have to go out shopping for a new buggy whip.

Billy:

Now you are starting to sound like me, !

MTD, Sr.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

True, but he's sort of forced to do it that far out. If he doesn't, someone else will grab all the better officials and he'll be left with the leftovers. His schools will be unsatisfied with what he has and will find someone else.

That is one of the downsides of having multiple assignors in the same area. With just one, it doesn't matter how early the schools get their schedules out.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

True, but he's sort of forced to do it that far out. If he doesn't, someone else will grab all the better officials and he'll be left with the leftovers. His schools will be unsatisfied with what he has and will find someone else.

That is one of the downsides of having multiple assignors in the same area. With just one, it doesn't matter how early the schools get their schedules out.

Right and I get that, but speaking from an official’s perspective I’d hate to have to commit to a Tuesday night in December months, if not years, in advance just to find out a few weeks before that I have to go on a business trip for my bill-paying job. Is the assigner really going to give me a hard time for giving that game back?

And I can only imagine how s*itty it would feel to be a transfer coming into a state like Wisconsin just to be told that games for the next two seasons are already given out and you’re basically just a fill-in.

Really it is the schools that ultimately force the assigners to schedule this way by making their game schedules so far in advance. Like I mentioned, in my state schools weren’t even thinking about 2018-19 basketball schedules until this past summer, and there are plenty that are still trying to get their last dates filled before practice starts.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

In my state there are many schools that probably don't even have their schedules finalized for the impending season. Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here, 1-2 weeks for subvarsity. I wouldn't want to get games much earlier than that; there are too many things that can change with respect to my availability.

When in Rome...

It is easy whenever Friday is a premium date for all officials (at least on with boys games). Everybody works on Friday for the most part at all levels. Tuesday is another boys typical game night. If you work girls basketball, you likely get a combination with the other dates. If you are a college official, you likely will not working high school games on Saturday for the most part.

So yes you do know what you are doing here when that is the standard. My goal as an official early in my career was to work a varsity boys game every Tuesday and Friday during the week. I get it that it is different, but not hard to deal with when those are things that have been done since I was in high school which was in the 80s and 90s.

The games for the coming season I started to receive almost 14 months in advance in some cases.

Peace

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is easy whenever Friday is a premium date for all officials (at least on with boys games). Everybody works on Friday for the most part at all levels. Tuesday is another boys typical game night. If you work girls basketball, you likely get a combination with the other dates. If you are a college official, you likely will not working high school games on Saturday for the most part.

So yes you do know what you are doing here when that is the standard. My goal as an official early in my career was to work a varsity boys game every Tuesday and Friday during the week. I get it that it is different, but not hard to deal with when those are things that have been done since I was in high school which was in the 80s and 90s.

The games for the coming season I started to receive almost 14 months in advance in some cases.

Peace

You’re completely ignoring conflicts that come up in one’s personal life that can’t be foreseen from so far out. Officiating high school basketball is not most people’s first priority.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

In my state there are many schools that probably don't even have their schedules finalized for the impending season. Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here, 1-2 weeks for subvarsity. I wouldn't want to get games much earlier than that; there are too many things that can change with respect to my availability.

When in Rome...

That's simply not true. Most of us assign by crew. If one official turns a game back, the crew finds a replacement. If that person is good enough for the CREW (who has to work with him/her), that person's good enough for me. Unless I've been burned by that person and won't hire him/her, of course.

I have 350 games to assign. If I'm the only conference not assigning 15 months in advance, I am not getting ANY of the best crews.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Rich

That's simply not true. Most of us assign by crew. If one official turns a game back, the crew finds a replacement. If that person is good enough for the CREW (who has to work with him/her), that person's good enough for me. Unless I've been burned by that person and won't hire him/her, of course.

I have 350 games to assign. If I'm the only conference not assigning 15 months in advance, I am not getting ANY of the best crews.

Things are just different in your area. We don't find subs here (or in other states I've worked in, or for college games) if we have to give a game back.

I also think the crew concept in basketball is dumb, and further excludes new/transfer officials. I get that that's not your problem as an assigner, but still. I'd hate to have to relocate to Wisconsin from an officiating perspective (and because of the weather).

I get why YOU assign 15 months out, in the context of the way things work in your state. My point was that overall, as a system, I would not be a fan and am glad games here don't generally go out more than 3 weeks ahead of time.