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Hard foul, intentional, flagrant ? (HS)
Hard foul ... and more?
First, let me say I'm not an official. I'm a coach of some three decades and I really enjoy the game management that officials provide. I seem to equally enjoy the conversations around rules, enforcement, and the myriad viewpoints of you guys running the floor. So thanks for this forum. Should I ever be out of line, and I doubt that will be the case, please feel free to set me straight. Here I'm posting a play from a recent HS BV game in Seattle. I realize the video makes it difficult to determine the nature or degree of the foul. But I'm wondering about the nuances differentiating a tough, hard-nosed foul from an intentional or flagrant. Here the shooter is airborne but is the contact excessive merely because the shooter goes down hard? (19.3.d). |
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Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010) |
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It was a hard foul, but it looked like to me just a normal shooting foul. Both tried to play the ball and one might have had a clean block. Just unfortunate how he fell but I would not call this anything but a shooting foul.
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010) |
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I think you mean shooting foul. A common foul by definition is not a shooting foul. Unless you think this foul is "on the floor".
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If some rules are never enforced, then why do they exist? |
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How does one "excessively contact the ball" and consequently be considered as having committed a foul against his/her opponent? Basketball Rules Fundamentals 10. "Personal fouls always involve illegal contact . . ." 4-19-1 . . . A personal foul is a player foul which involves illegal contact with an opponent. You mention "by rule" and "by case." To which "case" are you referring?
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To be good at a sport, one must be smart enough to play the game -- and dumb enough to think that it's important . . . |
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"RULING: An intentional foul shall be charged when the contact is judged to be excessive, even though the opponent is playing the ball. (4-11) "
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If some rules are never enforced, then why do they exist? |
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The intended understanding of this Case Book play is that the opponent "playing the ball" does not indemnify the opponent from responsibility for "subsequent contact with the ballhandler," even to the extent that excessive contact, after "playing the ball" may rise to the level of warranting an intentional foul being called. Simply, and admittedly redundant as it may be, a hand on the ball is not "contact" for the purpose of judging whether a foul is to be assessed, regardless of the force applied by the opponent, to the ball. Only contact with the person of the opponent can be judged to warrant a foul being called.
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To be good at a sport, one must be smart enough to play the game -- and dumb enough to think that it's important . . . |
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The defender looked to be trying to make a play on the ball, and his follow through after missing the block hit the shooter, causing the shooter to land hard. The defender did not look to be trying to foul, nor do his actions indicate to me he was being overly forceful in taking the shooter down after contact.
Two shots |
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