Held Ball or Travel?

[RefBob]

Girl's middle school game. A1 goes up for a jump shot. While both A1's feet are in the air B1 swipes at the ball and connects with a glancing hit on the ball. The ball is not dislodged from A1's grasp. In fact, the position of the ball in A1's hands is not really affected by the hit. A1 does not release the ball and lands back on the floor on both feet. In my opinion, B1's hit "caused" A1 to not release the ball but did not "prevent" A1 from releasing the ball. I call a travel. Coach is in my ear, saying "but B1 hit the ball." I say, that is true but that B1's contact on the ball was not sufficient to prevent A1 from releasing.

Did I make the right call?

Thanks.

[deecee]

sounds like a travel. The standard is did the contact prevent the offensive player from releasing the ball for a pass/shot.

[jeremy341a]

Travel as described.

[bob jenkins]

99% of the time, this is a held ball.

You might have had the 1% play.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

99% of the time, this is a held ball.

You might have had the 1% play.

Maybe.

If in doubt, it's a held ball.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by RefBob

Girl's middle school game. A1 goes up for a jump shot. While both A1's feet are in the air B1 swipes at the ball and connects with a glancing hit on the ball. The ball is not dislodged from A1's grasp. In fact, the position of the ball in A1's hands is not really affected by the hit. A1 does not release the ball and lands back on the floor on both feet. In my opinion, B1's hit "caused" A1 to not release the ball but did not "prevent" A1 from releasing the ball. I call a travel. Coach is in my ear, saying "but B1 hit the ball." I say, that is true but that B1's contact on the ball was not sufficient to prevent A1 from releasing.

Did I make the right call?

Thanks.

I find that distinction very hard to visualize. The picture I get is a held ball, but as Bob says this could be the very rare play that comes out another way.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

I find that distinction very hard to visualize. The picture I get is a held ball, but as Bob says this could be the very rare play that comes out another way.

The distinction is whether A1 has the option to release it or not and chooses not to verses the ball being pinned by B1 so that A1 can't release it even if desired. A mere touch of the ball doesn't necessarily pin the ball.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

The distinction is whether A1 has the option to release it or not and chooses not to verses the ball being pinned by B1 so that A1 can't release it even if desired. A mere touch of the ball doesn't necessarily pin the ball.

If the player is forced to chuck it up disadvantaged greatly by the hand on the ball, I'd expect an official to call a held ball.

This is not a place I'm picking nits or showing everyone how smart I am.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Rich

If the player is forced to chuck it up disadvantaged greatly by the hand on the ball, I'd expect an official to call a held ball.

This is not a place I'm picking nits or showing everyone how smart I am.

Agree, when the ball is pinned between the defender's hand and the shooters. But merely having a defender in the way that brushes the ball is not what is intended....that is good defense.

[BillyMac]

When an airborne player keeps control of an attempted shot that is blocked, is unable to release the ball, and returns to the floor with it, that player has not traveled; it is a held ball. If, in this situation, the shooter loses control of the ball because of the block, then this is simply a blocked shot, and play continues. If, in this situation, the defender simply touches the ball, and the airborne shooter returns to the floor holding the ball, it’s a traveling violation. When an airborne player tries for goal, sees that the try will be blocked, purposely drops the ball, and touches the ball after it hits the floor, that player has traveled by starting a dribble with the pivot foot off the floor

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

The distinction is whether A1 has the option to release it or not and chooses not to verses the ball being pinned by B1 so that A1 can't release it even if desired. A mere touch of the ball doesn't necessarily pin the ball.

I understand the distinction, but the post said that it caused the player not to release -- I have trouble picturing the contact causing the ball not to b released without preventing it from being released within the meaning of the rule.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

I understand the distinction, but the post said that it caused the player not to release -- I have trouble picturing the contact causing the ball not to b released without preventing it from being released within the meaning of the rule.

A player can "cause" an opponent to not release a shot without ever touching the ball (and not fouling either). "Cause" is too ambiguous to know what actually happened.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

A player can "cause" an opponent to not release a shot without ever touching the ball (and not fouling either).

Of course. But irrelevant: the OP said it was the contact on the ball that caused the player not to release. I have trouble picturing a real world play in which that cause exists without also being prevention. But I agree it is impossible to tell without seeing the play. I *suspect* the OP was looking for too much to reach "prevent," but I can do no more than suspect.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Of course. But irrelevant: the OP said it was the contact on the ball that caused the player not to release. I have trouble picturing a real world play in which that cause exists without also being prevention. But I agree it is impossible to tell without seeing the play. I *suspect* the OP was looking for too much to reach "prevent," but I can do no more than suspect.

The defender can touch the ball such that the shooter thinks they can no longer easily "make" the shot but could easily shoot it anyway. The shooter chooses not to release the ball. That is causing it without preventing it.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

The defender can touch the ball such that the shooter thinks they can no longer easily "make" the shot but could easily shoot it anyway. The shooter chooses not to release the ball. That is causing it without preventing it.

I'm guessing that's a held ball 99% of the time as called by officials. Wouldn't argue with them either.