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  #31 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 01:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dad View Post
Players use the rules to gain an advantage all the time, especially in stopping the clock. From the sounds of it a few want to give the defense a T for intelligent play. Why not T the offensive for unsporting when they throw the ball high into the air to run the clock out?
Now we are comparing apples and oranges..haha

It is a simple question and we are having a hard time finding a clear line.

If I use a DOG in a tight game with seconds left does the book clearly want a DOG to help the defense or with our judgement could it be something more. Honestly I wish we had more insight as I bet this happens more then we realize or hear about.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 01:26pm
Dad Dad is offline
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Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I disagree that this covers it. The play and rule are for your typical lets play jungle ball and slow down the inbounds cuz I am tired. This kid clearly wanted to give his team a chance to set up defense and stop the clock. We have rules that discuss trying to stop the clock with a foul to win a game. This is more complicated. Though the book isnt giving us a clear leg to stand on it does seem to me to be more complicated then a DOG which helps the defense. Though calling the DOG gives the winning coach a chance to call a TO if he has been smart enough to save one.
The OP later said there were no TOs left. I could easily imagine the coach telling his players to go for a violation to stop the clock.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 01:26pm
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Originally Posted by PG_Ref View Post
Actually, an official does have a rules basis to go directly to a T in this situation, if warranted. It's covered under rule 10-3-5.

ART. 5

A player shall not:

Delay the game by acts such as:

a. Preventing the ball from being made live promptly or from being put in play.
Wow PG_Ref great find and in my opinion with all the details of what happened in that game that is what I am using on that kid.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 01:28pm
Dad Dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Now we are comparing apples and oranges..haha

It is a simple question and we are having a hard time finding a clear line.

If I use a DOG in a tight game with seconds left does the book clearly want a DOG to help the defense or with our judgement could it be something more. Honestly I wish we had more insight as I bet this happens more then we realize or hear about.
Players intentionally touch the ball after a made basket all the time and we call a delay. There is nothing in the rule book to change this rule until the final five seconds of the game.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 01:29pm
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Originally Posted by gslefeb View Post
see case play - 9.2.10 sit A comment.


In situations with the clock running and five or less seconds left in the game, a throw-in plane violation or interfering with the ball following a goal should be ignored if its only purpose is to stop the clock. However, if the tactic in any way interferes with the thrower’s efforts to make a throw-in, a technical foul for delay shall be called even though no previous warning had been issued. In this situation, if the official stopped the clock and issued a team warning, it would allow the team to benefit from the tactic.
I like this one too. And another reason I think leaning toward the T is the right call. Though if I were watching Dad and he called a DOG I wouldnt have an issue either. Again sometimes there are just judgements we have to make.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 04:12pm
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Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The OP changed the parameters of the scenario after he received some answers.
I don't think I changed anything from OP. I just wanted to know straight up was it within the rules to go to a T, bypassing the DOG. Yes, I thought further explanation was due after seeing a few comments and so I posted the play as I saw it last night, but more so for the benefit of seeing why the OP. To me, whether or not the trailing coach has any time outs left is irrelevant (he surely would have used one if he had one).
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 04:20pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by letemplay View Post
"COULD" a delay of game T be called prior to warning in this sitch:

Following basket by B, B5 gets ball out of net and acts as if he's looking for ref, while at same time drifting back upcourt with ball, clearly (whether intentional or not is only known to him I suppose) delaying action to allow his team a press set up. Team A has player on baseline for throw in and other players in immediate position to field inbounds pass, but a few seconds at least are used by B5's actions. After getting to about 3 point line, he finally throws it half across court to baseline official, who passes it over to A1 to make inbound pass. While this definitely deserves a delay WARNING, could a T be called?
Quote:
Originally Posted by letemplay View Post
I don't think I changed anything from OP. I just wanted to know straight up was it within the rules to go to a T, bypassing the DOG. Yes, I thought further explanation was due after seeing a few comments and so I posted the play as I saw it last night, but more so for the benefit of seeing why the OP. To me, whether or not the trailing coach has any time outs left is irrelevant (he surely would have used one if he had one).
The time left in the game is relevant as you can see from some of the rule citations that have followed.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 06, 2016, 04:26pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
The time left in the game is relevant as you can see from some of the rule citations that have followed.
Yes, I see what you mean. Middle of game, nobody thinks otherwise of a DOG. Good point.
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