First Time Doing Men's League

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by bainsey

I don't do rec basketball (save for a couple of charity tourneys), but I know someone who runs one, and has a simple rule:

Any technical foul is a $25 fine, payable immediately. You can't play again until it's paid.

The league I work is $10, and you're out for the remainder of the half in which the TF occurs.

Several years ago, it was only $5 and just had to be paid before you could come back in, but most players had their money on the table before we finished shooting the FTs.

[Kansas Ref]

Originally Posted by Whistles & Stripes

Yeah, but if it's a running clock, as the league I work is, then do it, and take your time doing so.

*Yep, you guys/gals are sharp! That is why I do take the time to report warnings to the scorer table because that league had a running 20 minute clock--and it took me like 1 full minute to report the incident, another 30 seconds to re-assemble players for a throw-in to resume play, and another 30 seconds for the players to re-organize/compose themselves. Thus, the action accomplished a two-fold purpose for me: 1) to initiate "progressive discipline" and 2) to accelerate/shorten the completion time of said contest.

[Amesman]

With men's leagues, so much depends on the level of play and the earnestness of the players (and as noted earlier, administration).

Meaning, many guys are out there playing to get some exercise or share some camaraderie. Get in their mindset. They'll be pissed at themselves more than you in many cases. That's why it pays to not react to every single utterance or first reaction.

Thinking back to my own men's league days, when things were going south, I'd usually a) get on myself (not always non-profanely) or, less often, b) blame a ref (non-profanely).

The key is how quickly a player lets go of it. If he keeps harping, get out the stop sign. His teammates will probably thank you.

As I used to good-naturedly tell the refs when I played, I paid to sweat and complain a bit. They got paid to hear it —*to some small degree. One particularly poor-performing Amesman night, before my officiating days started, I actually did chide a ref for supposedly not being in good position after I "was fouled" on a missed shot.

As we headed back down court, he calmly told me to take it easy and I shot back, "What I can't complain now?" He boomed back: "You can complain about your own playing, just not ME!" No extra testosterone, no T served. Message delivered and peace reigned.

A few months later, I went to my first officials association meeting and found out this guy was a state-finals official, the dean of area officials -- and is now one of my major assignors. True story. I've never brought it up with him, and I don't think he ever would remember anyway. Just water under the bridge.

Oh, finally: If you're going to take the paycheck for these games, you still have to hustle. You will save yourself a lot of grief if you don't appear to be lazy. Think about it: The last thing a panting, busting-butt player wants to see is a guy in stripes trailing plays, looking like he's there just to pick up the check.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Thanks for all of the input, it was really helpful. A couple of points:

1. It's a Sunday league, so availability due to HS games is not an issue.

2. On the subject of laziness, that's something that I noticed a lot with intramurals and weekend lower level tourneys-- refs that are way out of position, trailing fast breaks (i.e. just getting to half court as the L when the ball is put up), etc. It drives me crazy, and I hate when a member of my crew does it because it makes us both look terrible. If you can't get up and down reasonably, find a different hobby.

3. I'm not sure on the clock rules (hopefully it's running), but I really like the idea of taking your time to report the warning. It's a passive-aggressive jab back at the player on top of a good way to end the chirping.

4. I'm fairly certain that there is no fine for a "T," but I will definitely be approaching my buddy to suggest that for next year.

5. In the ref guidelines, it says to show up 15 min before your game. Doesn't sound like there will be a lot of time for a good solid pre-game.

[Raymond]

...

5. In the ref guidelines, it says to show up 15 min before your game. Doesn't sound like there will be a lot of time for a good solid pre-game.

If you want a pre game for a rec league you need to ride to the game with your partner. 15 to 30 minutes prior is standard for rec leagues around these parts

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[Rich]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

If you want a pre game for a rec league you need to ride to the game with your partner. 15 to 30 minutes prior is standard for rec leagues around these parts

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At 30 minutes, I'm about 20 minutes from arriving when I work youth/rec ball. My pregame is to change my shoes, decide who's tossing the ball, and deciding that we're not switching on non-shooting fouls.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Rich

At 30 minutes, I'm about 20 minutes from arriving when I work youth/rec ball. My pregame is to change my shoes, decide who's tossing the ball, and deciding that we're not switching on non-shooting fouls.

What this guy said (except I usually show up in my game shoes). Also a lot of these games get about 50% sprint from me. There is no way in hell I'm giving it 100% at a 4th grade girls tourney, and I guarantee you whatever percentage I give you still get a better product than many of the officials who just don't know how to ref.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by deecee

What this guy said (except I usually show up in my game shoes). Also a lot of these games get about 50% sprint from me. There is no way in hell I'm giving it 100% at a 4th grade girls tourney, and I guarantee you whatever percentage I give you still get a better product than many of the officials who just don't know how to ref.

Since when did 4th grade girls start playing in adult male rec leagues?

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[deecee]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

2. On the subject of laziness, that's something that I noticed a lot with intramurals and weekend lower level tourneys-- refs that are way out of position, trailing fast breaks (i.e. just getting to half court as the L when the ball is put up), etc. It drives me crazy, and I hate when a member of my crew does it because it makes us both look terrible. If you can't get up and down reasonably, find a different hobby.

I knew I saw it.

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

Thanks for all of the input, it was really helpful. A couple of points:



1. It's a Sunday league, so availability due to HS games is not an issue.



2. On the subject of laziness, that's something that I noticed a lot with intramurals and weekend lower level tourneys-- refs that are way out of position, trailing fast breaks (i.e. just getting to half court as the L when the ball is put up), etc. It drives me crazy, and I hate when a member of my crew does it because it makes us both look terrible. If you can't get up and down reasonably, find a different hobby.



3. I'm not sure on the clock rules (hopefully it's running), but I really like the idea of taking your time to report the warning. It's a passive-aggressive jab back at the player on top of a good way to end the chirping.



4. I'm fairly certain that there is no fine for a "T," but I will definitely be approaching my buddy to suggest that for next year.



5. In the ref guidelines, it says to show up 15 min before your game. Doesn't sound like there will be a lot of time for a good solid pre-game.

The league I'm in also has a 3 Ts per season per player limit. After that, you're done for the season.

[JWP]

Check with other officials and find out if the league administrators have your back. If they don't, do yourself a favor and pass.

I worked a wreck league where a player physically assaulted an official (threw a ball as hard as he could into the back of the official's head). The guy was given a lousy week's suspension. I quit. So did a bunch of others.

I have also worked for a park and recreation department that protected the refs. Two technicals on a team was a team forfeit. Players behaved themselves and played basketball.

Even then, it wasn't worth it.

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

When I do adult basketball in the off-season I engage in a lot more conversation with the players. At some point you just say, out loud, "ok, that's enough, play basketball". After that point you then have to follow through when someone crosses the line. Do that a couple times and you will find the players will respect you and move on to either playing basketball or finding another official to whine to.

I take this approach and it works well for me. Remember that they are adults too -- a lot different than high school kids. Treating them as such rather than trying to act like an authority figure goes a long way in my opinion. Most of the time. When they cross the line, they usually know it and aren't surprised by the penalty.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Last night went smooth for the most part. Had to T a guy up who didn't like a charge call so he threw the ball up to the rafters. Probably missed a call where a guy got a bloody nose, but I honestly still don't know how in the world it happened because there wasn't contact from my perspective. Obviously I wasn't in good position and missed something. Other than that, it was actually fun being able to tell players to quit whining or tell them how lazy their defense is when I call a reach that they don't like. It was pretty easy money. Thanks again for all the advice, it definitely helped.

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

when I call a reach that they don't like.

If I were playing, I wouldn't like any "reach" that you called.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Originally Posted by HokiePaul

If I were playing, I wouldn't like any "reach" that you called.

Handcheck. Old habits.