NCAA-M New Rules Thread

[Scrapper1]

Maybe it's new in the casebook, but haven't we always pretty much called it this way? No call, and when the coach yells, we say "Your guy created the contact, Coach". That's pretty standard around here at the college level, I think.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Maybe it's new in the casebook, but haven't we always pretty much called it this way? No call, and when the coach yells, we say "Your guy created the contact, Coach". That's pretty standard around here at the college level, I think.

Some have, some haven't.....hence the change/clarification.

[potato]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

NCAA-Men's

Rule 4-38 is going to be fun. Here is what the preface says:

"This rule change clarifies that an offensive player also has verticality rights and must be given enough space by the defender to make a normal basketball move"

We also now have 4-17.6.e & A.R. 89. Shooters can no longer move into the path of a forward-moving airborne defender to draw a foul.

this is fair to prevent Shooters from claiming cheap fouls on the faked defender, but you will expect alot more collision when driving towards the basket, defenders will simply jump into the path of the ball handler in advance knowing he will get away with the foul. And what decides whether a shooter is moving into the path, does it mean the shooter has to jump before the defender does, or simply imply that shooter has to reach that air space before the defender does irregardless who jumped 1st.

Originally Posted by potato

this is fair to prevent Shooters from claiming cheap fouls on the faked defender, but you will expect alot more collision when driving towards the basket, defenders will simply jump into the path of the ball handler in advance knowing he will get away with the foul. And what decides whether a shooter is moving into the path, does it mean the shooter has to jump before the defender does, or simply imply that shooter has to reach that air space before the defender does irregardless who jumped 1st.

Not sure I understand your point....could you draw us a diagram please?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by potato

this is fair to prevent Shooters from claiming cheap fouls on the faked defender, but you will expect alot more collision when driving towards the basket, defenders will simply jump into the path of the ball handler in advance knowing he will get away with the foul. And what decides whether a shooter is moving into the path, does it mean the shooter has to jump before the defender does, or simply imply that shooter has to reach that air space before the defender does irregardless who jumped 1st.

Please read the following:

Originally Posted by APG

A.R. 89. A1 tries a pump fake and defender B1, who is in legal guarding
position:

1. Jumps forward into the air and A1 then jumps forward and makes contact with B1 in the air; or

2. Jumps straight up in the air and A1 then jumps forward and makes contact with B1 in the air.

RULING 1: Even though B1 established legal guarding position on the floor, his jump forward and toward A1 is not a legal attempt to maintain legal guarding position so that any non-incidental contact with A1 is a personal foul on B1. However, if B1’s jump forward is in a direction that he clearly would not have made contact with the shooter, and the shooter moves sideways to cause the contact, B1 has not committed a personal foul. (Rule 4-17.6.e)

2: B1 has again established initial legal guarding position and his jump into the air is a legal attempt to maintain legal guarding position as long as the jump is within B1’s own vertical plane. Any subsequent contact by A1 jumping forward and into B1 is either a personal foul on A1 or incidental contact. (Rule 4-17.6.e)

Bolded portion is the new part of the case book play

Originally Posted by APG

Just showing what levels of play above NF are saying about this play:

NBA (2014-2015) Case Book:

262. Offensive Player A1 pump fakes a 3-point field goal attempt and Defender B1 clearly jumps/runs to the side of A1 and would not make any contact. Player A1 jumps sideways and initiates contact with Defender B1. How is this handled?

Since Defender B1 was not going to contact Player A1, a foul cannot be called on him assuming he did not reach over and hit his opponent. If the contact by A1 is marginal, meaning it did not affect B1’s ability to continue play, no foul has occurred. If the contact initiated by A1 is more than marginal, an offensive foul shall be assessed.

RULE 12B - SECTION VII

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by potato

this is fair to prevent Shooters from claiming cheap fouls on the faked defender, but you will expect alot more collision when driving towards the basket, defenders will simply jump into the path of the ball handler in advance knowing he will get away with the foul. And what decides whether a shooter is moving into the path, does it mean the shooter has to jump before the defender does, or simply imply that shooter has to reach that air space before the defender does irregardless who jumped 1st.

It is about when A1 goes in a direction that A1 was not previously going and has not realistic reason to go simply to create contact. If A1 is already driving down the lane and B1 jumps in the path, B1 must meet all the rules of LGP to not be called for a block since A1 had already established that path.

[Raymond]

Reset for 10 second B/C count except for:

a) defense causing ball to OOB in B/C.
b) technical foul of offense
c) held ball in B/C and offense retains possession.

So, should there be a reset of 10 second B/C count if:

1) after ball is dead and clock is stopped, offense is granted a time-out?
2) there is a double foul or a double technical foul?

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Reset for 10 second B/C count except for:

a) defense causing ball to OOB in B/C.
b) technical foul of offense
c) held ball in B/C and offense retains possession.

So, should there be a reset of 10 second B/C count if:

1) after ball is dead and clock is stopped, offense is granted a time-out?
2) there is a double foul or a double technical foul?

Here's the actual wording:

The 10-second count shall be reset on all stoppages of the game clock except when the defense causes the ball to be out of bounds, the offense retains the possession after a held ball, or there is a technical foul assessed against the offensive team�

The wording of the rule says the reason for the clock stoppage controls (rightly or wrongly).
1. If the clock stoppage was from defense knocking ball out then the wording of the rule says don't reset the clock. The rule doesn't say offense can buy a new count with the timeout. I think they should be able to but that isn't what it says. Apparently, they will have to throw the ball in and then call the timeout to get a new count…if needed.

2. Double foul isn't listed so reset the count. Double tech isn't listed so also reset the count. In both of those situations the defense is also doing something wrong so reset the count. (i realize in a double tech situation a technical foul is being "assessed against the offensive team" as mentioned in the rule but i think the double situation changes it. If they wanted double techs to prevent a reset of the clock they would have included double fouls.)

This is what i get from reading the rule--they may change/clarify/interp. They may have just overlooked situations.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Here's the actual wording:

The 10-second count shall be reset on all stoppages of the game clock except when the defense causes the ball to be out of bounds, the offense retains the possession after a held ball, or there is a technical foul assessed against the offensive team�

The wording of the rule says the reason for the clock stoppage controls (rightly or wrongly).
1. If the clock stoppage was from defense knocking ball out then the wording of the rule says don't reset the clock. The rule doesn't say offense can buy a new count with the timeout. I think they should be able to but that isn't what it says. Apparently, they will have to throw the ball in and then call the timeout to get a new count…if needed.

2. Double foul isn't listed so reset the count. Double tech isn't listed so also reset the count. In both of those situations the defense is also doing something wrong so reset the count. (i realize in a double tech situation a technical foul is being "assessed against the offensive team" as mentioned in the rule but i think the double situation changes it. If they wanted double techs to prevent a reset of the clock they would have included double fouls.)

This is what i get from reading the rule--they may change/clarify/interp. They may have just overlooked situations.

From my clinics so far, the consensus has been that the offense can buy back a 10-second count with a dead ball time-out. Art Hyland should have put case plays in for this new rule.

[bob jenkins]

FWIW, in NCAAW, Team A can call a TO to get a new 10-second count:

QUESTION:

Concerning adjustment to the 10 second back court rule, can you confirm that if a timeout is called, the offensive team gets a new 10 seconds. If so, what occurs if the defensive team deflects the ball out of bounds with 23 seconds remaining and then the offense calls a timeout?

ANSWER:

When the team in control calls a timeout and they have not advanced the ball out of their back court, the team will always receive a new 10-second count to advance the ball into their front court, even when the defense deflects the ball out of bounds, there is a held ball and the AP arrow favors the team in control or there is a technical foul assessed to the team in control.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

FWIW, in NCAAW, Team A can call a TO to get a new 10-second count:

QUESTION:

Concerning adjustment to the 10 second back court rule, can you confirm that if a timeout is called, the offensive team gets a new 10 seconds. If so, what occurs if the defensive team deflects the ball out of bounds with 23 seconds remaining and then the offense calls a timeout?

ANSWER:

When the team in control calls a timeout and they have not advanced the ball out of their back court, the team will always receive a new 10-second count to advance the ball into their front court, even when the defense deflects the ball out of bounds, there is a held ball and the AP arrow favors the team in control or there is a technical foul assessed to the team in control.

Does the NCAA-W rule read same or similar? As i said earlier, the offense should be able to buy a new count with a timeout but that isnt what the rule says. i cant read the new rule and determine/extrapolate etc that a timeout gives a new count. the wording doesnt support it. they need to add another sentence.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Does the NCAA-W rule read same or similar? As i said earlier, the offense should be able to buy a new count with a timeout but that isnt what the rule says. i cant read the new rule and determine/extrapolate etc that a timeout gives a new count. the wording doesnt support it. they need to add another sentence.

I think the rule reads exactly the same.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I think the rule reads exactly the same.

I'll, of course, call it however they want...It would be nice if they would actually put things in the rules or the case book. Buying a new count with a timeout isnt anywhere in the rules or case book. wouldnt be that hard to add....

[BigCat]

Prohibition on dunking during dead ball is lifted. I don't/won't care until somebody tears the rim or backboard off and delays me an hour....

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Prohibition on dunking during dead ball is lifted. I don't/won't care until somebody tears the rim or backboard off and delays me an hour....

My JuCo supervisor says there will be no dunking in his conference.