Texas - ASU game 3

[Durham]

Tony,

I would allow the action, because if you change it or add a rule to change it, then you will end up effecting far more than you intend to. Example, a guy gets picked off at first and then is hit in the back while running to first and the ball goes into the outfield allowing R1 to get to 3rd. Technically he interfered with a throw, but I think we can agree that we are not going to call interference unless it was an intentional act. I could come up with coutless other examples, but I think you see my point. Like I said earlier, I think the rules are rather clear, but I could be wrong. And that would not be the first time today.

[Larry1953]

Anybody else see the play in the SC/Virginia game? R1 is stealing, the batter swings and misses and ends up out of the batter's box. The catcher had to alter his throw and drop down sidearm to find a slot to make his throw. That made his throw slice away from the bag. I think that was clearly a BI infraction but it was not called. Orel told us that it was not because the catcher did not initiate contact.

[UMP25]

Yeah, and Robin Ventura the other day said a batter who squares to bunt has to pull his bat back in order to not have a strike called on him on the attempt.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Larry1953

Anybody else see the play in the SC/Virginia game? R1 is stealing, the batter swings and misses and ends up out of the batter's box. The catcher had to alter his throw and drop down sidearm to find a slot to make his throw. That made his throw slice away from the bag. I think that was clearly a BI infraction but it was not called. Orel told us that it was not because the catcher did not initiate contact.

Didn't you also post about this in the "terriffic call in CWS" thread? Please stop.

[MikeStrybel]

After so many pages of suspect information from members, I offer this from the NCAA Division I Baseball Game Officials Manual. It is issued to all Tournament umpires and they are expected to have it with them while in Omaha. From the section entitled: NCAA BASEBALL RULES COMMITTEE
FINAL RULES CHANGES – EFFECTIVE FOR 2011 AND 2012 SEASONS on
page 62:

Rule 2-50: Add to (3) on 6-3b (3): If the catcher‘s initial throw retires the runner and the batter does not strike out, the batter is not out and the interference is disregarded. The ball remains live and other runners may advance. [add—If there is an attempt by the catcher to throw and the attempt is aborted due to an action by the offense, the ball becomes dead immediately, the batter is out and all runners return to the base occupied at the time of the pitch (TOP). Rationale: This change makes consistent the wording for 6-3b and 7-11f with 2-50.

It appears that this year's very best have some of these points of emphasis in mind while working.

I find the Effort and Professionalism section for rating this year's crew extremely telling to those who still believe preventive umpiring is acceptable in better baseball.

Fraternization - Avoids excessive, casual, and/or unnecessary conversation with uniformed personnel or spectators, during the game

This is made easier by the fact that the crew is miked, but definetly something that bears watching. Finally, I have worked the Gerry Davis stance for a number of years now and have been comfortable seeing that ball. The current NCAA standards prohibit it. They only want the slot or modified slot used by tournament crew. I hate having to change but even if I never get a chance to shine in Omaha, I suspect that it is good advice and will adapt. The crews I've watched so far are really incredible at the plate.

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

Finally, I have worked the Gerry Davis stance for a number of years now and have been comfortable seeing that ball. The current NCAA standards prohibit it. They only want the slot or modified slot used by tournament crew.

So how does one explain the knee stance used by a guy the other day?

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by UMP25

So how does one explain the knee stance used by a guy the other day?

As stated in my original post, it is called the modified slot.

from the NCAA Plate Mechanics Ratings criteria:

Establishes locked in position on every pitch
Does not drift side to side or up and down with pitch
Does not flinch on swings or foul tips
Maintains proper spacing from catchers as not to become entangled if catcher moves quickly and unexpectedly
Eyes remain at horizontal level with ground and does not dip as game goes on.
Head at proper height to allow unobstructed view of entire plate
Works in the slot not over top of catcher or to the outside
Does not set in an unusually high or deep position that would draw attention or questioning of judgment

The slot is not the 'box', 'heel-toe' or 'straddle' stance. It is the area between the catcher and batter. They want your head in that space.

[UMP25]

I know what the slot is. I went to umpiring school.

I've seen many umpires use a modified form, if that's what one can call it, of the GD stance insofar as one's legs and hands on knees set.

[UmpJM]

Mike,

Originally Posted by MikeStrybel

... Finally, I have worked the Gerry Davis stance for a number of years now and have been comfortable seeing that ball. The current NCAA standards prohibit it. They only want the slot or modified slot used by tournament crew. I hate having to change but even if I never get a chance to shine in Omaha, I suspect that it is good advice and will adapt. The crews I've watched so far are really incredible at the plate.

The guy working the plat in the NC - Vandy eliminiation game (Scott Erby) is using a Davis stance - with slot positioning.

Much like Gerry himself:



An article written by Scott Ehret on the Davis system in 2009 also talks about using slot positioning when using the Davis stance.

The Davis Stance

A lot of the guys in my association use the Davis stance because Gerry came and taught at an association clinic around 2004-2005 (before I had joined) and they all use slot alignment positioning.

I wonder if his thinking changed to slot vs. "over the catcher" after you learned it.

JM

[Publius]

All Gerry has to do is take his exposed hand off his knee and let it dangle so he doesn't end up with broken fingers on a foul ball, and he'll be using the stance and position I've used for more than twenty years.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by Publius

All Gerry has to do is take his exposed hand off his knee and let it dangle so he doesn't end up with broken fingers on a foul ball, and he'll be using the stance and position I've used for more than twenty years.

Yes...as has been pointed out before, Gerry gave a name to a stance many umpires have used.

[DG]

Originally Posted by Publius

All Gerry has to do is take his exposed hand off his knee and let it dangle so he doesn't end up with broken fingers on a foul ball, and he'll be using the stance and position I've used for more than twenty years.

My thumb might be exposed a bit but fingers are not, and thumbe is a bit beside the shin guard, so it will take a direct to get me in the thumb. On the other hand, my pinky finger was broken about 8 years ago on an inside pitch with hand dangling, as you say, I since changed to GD.

I am sure Gerry will be in interested in your assessment

[MikeStrybel]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

Mike,



The guy working the plat in the NC - Vandy eliminiation game (Scott Erby) is using a Davis stance - with slot positioning.

Much like Gerry himself:



An article written by Scott Ehret on the Davis system in 2009 also talks about using slot positioning when using the Davis stance.

The Davis Stance

A lot of the guys in my association use the Davis stance because Gerry came and taught at an association clinic around 2004-2005 (before I had joined) and they all use slot alignment positioning.

I wonder if his thinking changed to slot vs. "over the catcher" after you learned it.

JM

Could be. MLB umpires take things, adapt and find comfort in them. Erby looks like he did. I was taught it in 2002 and guys my size were shown the "over the catcher" mechanic. It's funny to think back to that. Tschida taught base work, largely at first and presented a small step call. By that I mean, line up in A and take just a small step or two only with an adjustment lean for angle for calls at first - some looking in, almost straight down the line! It looked strange, and was soon abandoned by most who took a few steps inside and locked in, the way most collegiate and professional umpires work it. Evolution.

The CWS guys look great this year.

[TussAgee11]

Over the catcher = over the hitting zone = concussions.

PBUC is now teaching every single umpire, no matter the size, to get as far into the slot as possible.