Coach handling??

[MrUmpire]

Rich, I've been accused of thinking I was "bigger than the game" twice. Once was when I called a balk on a Syracuse pitcher for a move in the 9th inning that I called a balk on their opponent in the third inning.

The second time was when I called a runner out at the plate on a ball buster suicide squeeze that would have tied the game.

By my experience and that of others, I've come to see that the accusation of being "bigger than the game" usually is made when an umpire does his job during a critical moment of the game.

As for umpires who make that accusation against other umpires....they're usually Smittys or wannabees.

[David B]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Rich, I've been accused of thinking I was "bigger than the game" twice. Once was when I called a balk on a Syracuse pitcher for a move in the 9th inning that I called a balk on their opponent in the third inning.

The second time was when I called a runner out at the plate on a ball buster suicide squeeze that would have tied the game.

By my experience and that of others, I've come to see that the accusation of being "bigger than the game" usually is made when an umpire does his job during a critical moment of the game.

As for umpires who make that accusation against other umpires....they're usually Smittys or wannabees.

Very perceptive IMO. I agree also. The only times I've had that type of stuff thrown my way was when i actually had to make a "big call" usually in a "big game".

Of course, the reason that you are in position to make that "big call" is because you "are" willing to make the right call at the right time, no matter what coaches, assignors, or anyone else wants to say about it

Thanks
David

[ODJ]

O.P.

Did the catcher do a poor job framing/presenting the pitch? Was it in or outside? Did you simply miss the pitch?

[JFlores]

Originally Posted by ODJ

O.P.

Did the catcher do a poor job framing/presenting the pitch? Was it in or outside? Did you simply miss the pitch?

Left handed batter, outside pitch, catcher did a horrible job of presenting pitch all game, and to be honest I probably did miss it but it makes it much easier to ball when the catcher doesnt help out.

IMHO the coach was one of those that just likes to bark and hear himself talk, during the game he was on the far end of the dugout on his phone. The conduct of his players reflected on him. At the end of the day the game got settled between the lines, the opposing team being down 6-2, came back and won 14-6 behind 5 homeruns.

[Simply The Best]

Originally Posted by JFlores

IMHO the coach was one of those that just likes to bark and hear himself talk, during the game he was on the far end of the dugout on his phone. The conduct of his players reflected on him.

This is exactly why the question of how to handle coaches is never black and white. You have to take into consideration all the variables; treating coaches and situations with one broad brush approach is a recipe for disaster. Yet I see it all the time mostly from officials who simply don't have the mental savvy to think on their feet.

Here you have a coach who deserves very little consideration in terms of dicussing your B/S calls. Or much of any call for that matter as he is not only an arse he's teaching arse to his kids.

Cut to the coach who is the exact opposite. Refuses to allow his players to get in your ear and only asks, at the appropriate time and with respect, if you and he can discuss what's going on. Not why you missed the call but what should he and his catcher, in this case, do to to help you in your job.

You see, this coach is getting his point across and enhancing his chances for success and setting a solid, proper example. Let him. He deserves the consideration.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Simply The Best

This is exactly why the question of how to handle coaches is never black and white. You have to take into consideration all the variables; treating coaches and situations with one broad brush approach is a recipe for disaster. Yet I see it all the time mostly from officials who simply don't have the mental savvy to think on their feet.

Here you have a coach who deserves very little consideration in terms of dicussing your B/S calls. Or much of any call for that matter as he is not only an arse he's teaching arse to his kids.

Cut to the coach who is the exact opposite. Refuses to allow his players to get in your ear and only asks, at the appropriate time and with respect, if you and he can discuss what's going on. Not why you missed the call but what should he and his catcher, in this case, do to to help you in your job.

You see, this coach is getting his point across and enhancing his chances for success and setting a solid, proper example. Let him. He deserves the consideration.

Exactly why would you think that coaches are treated with one, broad brush? A coach gets all the respect he returns in every game and every sport I work. If a coach asks a question the right way and actually listens to the answer and I know he doesn't get upset for no good reason then of course I'll listen when he's upset -- he's proven that he's worth listening to and knows how to treat umpires/officials.

Internet posting is very one dimensional -- it's hard to express nuance from a keyboard. There are some absolutes, as far as I'm concerned (my ejection last season was for being called ridiculous after we had interference on an infield fly that resulted in a double play -- no coach is going to stay after calling me a name), but no good umpire/official is going to survive long without having a mouth AND an ear and knowing when to use the right one at the right time.

[JRutledge]

If I have learned anything from this discussion and other discussions, how you handle a coach is personal. I deal with coaches how they deal with me. If they want to be bombastic and embarrass me, they will not be around long. I do not bread my butter by the opinions of any coach. I have worked too many games to realize (especially in baseball) they have very little say in anything I do ultimately. They often get who they get because not everyone can work anywhere and at anytime like other sports.

Work your games, learn from other umpires and do your best. If that is not good enough for coaches, they will not be around long enough for it to matter anyway.

Peace

[Simply The Best]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Exactly why would you think that coaches are treated with one, broad brush?

Because by some umpires including ones on this forum, they are. Some officials approach is combative (because they are insecure imo), some consider coaches sub-human ("rats" - just another form of insecurity imo). Consequently, every coach they encounter is treated the same either as a combatant or a rat.

[Simply The Best]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

A coach gets all the respect he returns in every game and every sport I work. If a coach asks a question the right way and actually listens to the answer and I know he doesn't get upset for no good reason then of course I'll listen when he's upset -- he's proven that he's worth listening to and knows how to treat umpires/officials.

The outcome is fine but the approach is completely bassakward. Start the game with respect for the coach not "he gets what he returns" which is either a neutral position, or imo considering your posts past" begins in a negative, combative posture.

Coaches, who btw are people, read your body language, your tone of voice, the lokk you do or don't give them at the home plate meeting, from third base, the dugout...they read and they judge how they are being perceived.

So it is mightily important to start the game with respect for people (coaches in this context) or you are doing nothing more than predetermining the outcome of the coach-official relationship.

Internet posting is very one dimensional -- it's hard to express nuance from a keyboard.

I would strongly disagree. For instance, the use of and and delivers a message as does bolding (my bet is you quite well understand how much I strongly disagree with you ), italicizing and several other non dimensional features.

Over time, the attitude of the poster, the point of his posts, the clarity in which he writes, his use of language, proper punctuation and a flurry of other factors highlight who he is, what he stands for, where his points of interest are...well, you get the idea...dimensionally.

There are some absolutes, as far as I'm concerned (my ejection last season was for being called ridiculous after we had interference on an infield fly that resulted in a double play -- no coach is going to stay after calling me a name)

Unless you posted this incident incorrectly, he didn't call you a name, he commented on the absurdity of the call, very different situation. Nothing personal there, dude, lighten up, again, this goes back to my first paragraph above. How you approach the game and the people. I would have gotten a good laugh out of that. Only a dunce for a coach believes he is going to gain anything positive by using such a redikalous term as "ridiculous". Think of it this way.

Stupidity is God's gift called light humour.

...but no good umpire/official is going to survive long without having a mouth AND an ear and knowing when to use the right one at the right time.

Here we go again. I strongly disagree. I know very good, even excellent officials who are quiet, to the point, rarely verbal or verbose and hear hardly anthing from fans, coaches or players.

I would not be in that group but I also would not paint them with that wide brush (remember the wide brush we discussed earlier in this thread...here it is again...) of not having survivability.

Fact is, they can be alive and well and amongst us at this very moment.

FYI, note how I spelled "humour", I did that to fool you into thinking I am a Brit. Funny how dimensionality can work with Internet posting.

[ODJ]

Originally Posted by JFlores

Left handed batter, outside pitch, catcher did a horrible job of presenting pitch all game, and to be honest I probably did miss it but it makes it much easier to ball when the catcher doesnt help out.

IMHO the coach was one of those that just likes to bark and hear himself talk, during the game he was on the far end of the dugout on his phone. The conduct of his players reflected on him. At the end of the day the game got settled between the lines, the opposing team being down 6-2, came back and won 14-6 behind 5 homeruns.

From this description, I'd take the coach at his word that he was frustrated and barking at his catcher, not you.

In this case, I say nothing or wait until the inning is over.