Catch question- Bizzaro world play

[bluehair]

Originally Posted by mbyron

If it were easy, we'd see it all the time. TWP.

I agree that is probably a TWP. But if it did happen early in a game and you allowed this cheap DP/TP. Then every pop-up with runners on would be turned into cheap DP attempt. What a mess that would be.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbyron

You've got to be kidding. No rule specifically allows any action to take place. The rules prohibit certain defined actions (OBS, INT, illegal bats, etc.), and allow everything else.

Interpretations, however, can allow for specific and prohibit specific actions.

If you think just because it's not specifically listed in the rule book, then an action is legal, you are wrong.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by asdf

If you think just because it's not specifically listed in the rule book, then an action is legal, you are wrong.

I think that the rules prohibit all illegal baseball actions. They fail to prohibit things like poisoning an opponent or digging a trench around 2B, but that is irrelevant to the case in point.

You still have no rules basis for your position.

[dash_riprock]

Originally Posted by mbyron

They fail to prohibit things like poisoning an opponent...

I've always let that one go anyway.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbyron

I think that the rules prohibit all illegal baseball actions. They fail to prohibit things like poisoning an opponent or digging a trench around 2B, but that is irrelevant to the case in point.

You still have no rules basis for your position.

You won't find anything in the rules about a runner advancing from 1st to second on a delayed double steal (runner on 3rd) by performing backward hand springs, yet I think you are savvy enough to see that this is an illegal act.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by asdf

You won't find anything in the rules about a runner advancing from 1st to second on a delayed double steal (runner on 3rd) by performing backward hand springs, yet I think you are savvy enough to see that this is an illegal act.

Uh... what?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by asdf

You won't find anything in the rules about a runner advancing from 1st to second on a delayed double steal (runner on 3rd) by performing backward hand springs, yet I think you are savvy enough to see that this is an illegal act.

Why is it illegal? And, don't use "unsporting act" because that's in the rules.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Why is it illegal? And, don't use "unsporting act" because that's in the rules.

C'mon Bob...

You know that the definition of interference in all of the rule codes (OBR, NCAA, NFHS) includes the word "confuse(s)".

You also know that there is an acceptable way to "confuse" an opponent. (fake cut-off, fake catch of a throw to a base, third-to-first step and throwback, runner stops between 1st and 2nd in an attempt to get in a run-down so he can score the runner from third....etc)

All of these are a part of the game.

The intentional juggle and my example of backward handsprings are not (yes, they are unsporting) and should be dealt with immediately.

[mbyron]

I see you make up all kinds of rules for yourself. Go for it. I'm done with you.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbyron

I see you make up all kinds of rules for yourself. Go for it. I'm done with you.

Great, while you are done with me, I will keep looking for that rule prohibiting digging a trench around 2nd base. You cannot have it both ways.

You know, a few years ago, the handspring situation cropped up in high school football. There was much discussion, similar to this. Those saying it was legal cited "nothing in the rule book", those saying it was illegal backed it up with the "not part of the game" angle.

The Asst. Commissioner, who happens to be in charge of the officials in Ohio, stated, that if someone let this action go unpenalized and he got wind of it, he was pulling their permit.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by asdf

Great, while you are done with me, I will keep looking for that rule prohibiting digging a trench around 2nd base. You cannot have it both ways.

You know, a few years ago, the handspring situation cropped up in high school football. There was much discussion, similar to this. Those saying it was legal cited "nothing in the rule book", those saying it was illegal backed it up with the "not part of the game" angle.

The Asst. Commissioner, who happens to be in charge of the officials in Ohio, stated, that if someone let this action go unpenalized and he got wind of it, he was pulling their permit.

Wouldn't doing hand springs in a high school game be considered taunting?

OTOH, consider yourself lucky the mbyron is done with you. However the downside of that, you will now have to be responsible for your grammatical and spelling errors. You're on your own now, buddy.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by asdf

C'mon Bob...

You know that the definition of interference in all of the rule codes (OBR, NCAA, NFHS) includes the word "confuse(s)".

You also know that there is an acceptable way to "confuse" an opponent. (fake cut-off, fake catch of a throw to a base, third-to-first step and throwback, runner stops between 1st and 2nd in an attempt to get in a run-down so he can score the runner from third....etc)

All of these are a part of the game.

The intentional juggle and my example of backward handsprings are not (yes, they are unsporting) and should be dealt with immediately.

Holy cow, are you kidding? You would stop someone from the handspring thing? Really? Which rule - unsporting or confusing - you seem to want both. Don't invent rules - we have enough as it is.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by asdf

The Asst. Commissioner, who happens to be in charge of the officials in Ohio, stated, that if someone let this action go unpenalized and he got wind of it, he was pulling their permit.

Actually, you're mistaken there. Football specifically includes antics used to show up an opponent inside it's USC rules. I would definitely penalize this in football. I'd have no backing to do that in baseball.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Holy cow, are you kidding? You would stop someone from the handspring thing? Really? Which rule - unsporting or confusing - you seem to want both. Don't invent rules - we have enough as it is.

1) Combine both... interference and then eject......

2) Not inventing anything here.... for FED see 3-3-1 (g)(4)

A coach, player, substitute, attendant, or other bench personell shall not....

....commit any unsportsmanlike act to include, but not limited to;

....behavior in any manner not in accordance with the spirit of fair play


It all boils down to what the spirit of fair play is in our eyes.

If I am working the game, this activity stops here and now. I have folks unhappy with me for a while, but we get back to baseball.

If you are working said game, the activity turns into the "one-up 'em" mode and we have some sort of retaliation because of the chickenbleep activity by a team.

If called on the carpet, my defense of "this isn't what baseball is all about" carries a whole bunch more credibility than your "the rules don't prohibit this action" excuse.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Actually, you're mistaken there. Football specifically includes antics used to show up an opponent inside it's USC rules. I would definitely penalize this in football. I'd have no backing to do that in baseball.

Football didn't address this until after it happened. The handsprings ocurred not after a score, but as a player was going in motion, "legally" parallel to the line of scrimmage.

No different than "legally" doing handsprings in the baseline.