Appeal play?

[DG]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

One of those states is in the south east -- either one of the Carolinas or Georgia, but I forget which.

It's not North Carolina..

[UmpJM]

It's South Carolina.

JM

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by dash_riprock

A verbal appeal can only be made when the ball is dead. 8-2-6-c.

A verbal appeal by a coach can only be made when the ball is dead. A player can verbally appeal when the ball is live.

[UmpJM]

Originally Posted by zm1283

A verbal appeal by a coach can only be made when the ball is dead. A player can verbally appeal when the ball is live.

zm,

I'm out of town on business at the moment and don't have my FED books with me, but I don't believe that's correct.

I can't quote you "chapter and verse" at the moment, but I believe that Dash's assertion that the (solely) verbal appeal in FED is only sustained when the ball is dead and any runners have "completed" their baserunning.

JM

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

zm,

I'm out of town on business at the moment and don't have my FED books with me, but I don't believe that's correct.

I can't quote you "chapter and verse" at the moment, but I believe that Dash's assertion that the (solely) verbal appeal in FED is only sustained when the ball is dead and any runners have "completed" their baserunning.

JM

You're right. I was thinking of the part where players or the coach are allowed to verbally appeal when the ball is dead. Nevermind.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

...all but the accidental appeal where the umpire simply calls the runner/BR out.

Although neither one is currently on the books, it's worth distinguishing between the automatic appeal and the accidental appeal, as they are different.

The automatic appeal (which isn't really an appeal at all) is the play where the umpire calls a runner out for a baserunning infraction (such as a missed base) when he sees it. No action is required by the defense to initiate such an appeal. This rule, defunct for years, actually brought umpiring a little closer to officiating in other sports, where a violation is flagged, whistled, etc. immediately, without requiring the defense to notice it and do something to initiate the penalty.

The accidental appeal is the play where a fielder happens to have the ball and step on a base that a runner has just missed, not intending thereby to appeal an infraction. This would happen most commonly at 1B, on a play where the ball is late, the runner is well past the base, but has missed the base. There's still a case in the case book (8.2.3) that seems to legitimize the accidental appeal, though it conflicts with the rule change (8-2-6).

As usual, terminology matters.

[greymule]

The accidental appeal in Fed was actually the accidental force play, though it did apply at 1B, which is of course not technically a force.

It applied only on missed bases to which a runner was forced, not to non-forced bases or bases left too soon.

If the BR beat the throw to 1B but missed the bag, he was to be called out. If a forced runner missed 2B and was tagged after he reached 3B safely, he was also to be called out on the accidental force play. (The theory, contrary to every other code, was that he had not yet touched 2B.)

It was the accidental force play that I was thinking of when I said, "a few years ago" in an earlier post. I think the accidental force play went out in 2001 or 2002.

[#888]

South Carolina does not use...appeal for a missed base...or leaving a base to soon....umpire calls runner out at conclusion of play...

Also ..no batters box rule is used .. for additional strike...etc.

[celebur]

Originally Posted by #888

South Carolina does not use...appeal for a missed base...or leaving a base to soon....umpire calls runner out at conclusion of play...

Also ..no batters box rule is used .. for additional strike...etc.

I didn't realize...that William Shatner...was posting here...

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by celebur

I didn't realize...that William Shatner...was posting here...

This...is the final...frontier.

[Skahtboi]

She....packed my bags.......last night.........pre........flight... Zero hour.........nine.... AM. And I'm gonna be.....high...........as a kite...........by then.

[greymule]

These are… suspension points.

This is . . . an ellipsis.

Few people know the difference.

[celebur]

Originally Posted by greymule

These are… suspension points.

This is . . . an ellipsis.

Few people know the difference.

Are you . . . deliberately trying... to spoil our fun?

[celebur]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

She....packed my bags.......last night.........pre........flight... Zero hour.........nine.... AM. And I'm gonna be.....high...........as a kite...........by then.

Climb in...the back...with...your head...in the clouds,
And...you're gone.

[johnnyg08]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Although neither one is currently on the books, it's worth distinguishing between the automatic appeal and the accidental appeal, as they are different.
as usual, terminology matters.

you are correct, my terminology was wrong. thank you