Batter picking up the ball

[chitownvet]

I find this forum to be exceptionally helpful all the time. I have one situation that happened recently in a men's league game that I hope that I made the proper call.

There are 2 outs, runners on 2nd and 3rd. The batter takes ball four as the pitch is in the dirt and deflects off the catchers shin guard a little ways down the first base line. I look to see if the runner on third is making a break for the plate, and he is moving towards the plate but not rapidly. The runner on second is moving the same towards third base. The catcher is moving swiftly to pick up the ball, and as he gets closer the batter/runner picks up the ball in an effort to throw it back to the pitcher. As the defensive team starts to squawk, I call the batter/runner out for interference to end the inning.

Was this the proper call?

[johnnyg08]

Sounds like it probably was the right call. Furthermore, since you called the out for interference, the batter/runner and the other two rosters also learned something...Leave the live ball alone! Sounds like a pretty easy call. Offense argue at all?

[SanDiegoSteve]

Yes.

6.06 (c) He interferes with the catcher’s fielding or throwing by stepping out of the batter’s box or making any other movement that hinders the catcher’s play at home base. EXCEPTION: Batter is not out if any runner attempting to advance is put out, or if runner trying to score is called out for batter’s interference.

Rule 6.06(c) Comment: If the batter interferes with the catcher, the plate umpire shall call “interference.” The batter is out and the ball dead. No player may advance on such interference (offensive interference) and all runners must return to the last base that was, in the judgment of the umpire, legally touched at the time of the interference.

[chitownvet]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

Sounds like it probably was the right call. Furthermore, since you called the out for interference, the batter/runner and the other two rosters also learned something...Leave the live ball alone! Sounds like a pretty easy call. Offense argue at all?

No, they did yell at the guy who picked it up though. But later I started having doubts about the call.

[UmpJM]

chitownvet,

This is probably most properly ruled "weak interference" - kill it, send the runners back, tell the BR he really shouldn't ought to do that.

Of course, if you got an out, and the only one anybody got upset with was the clueless BR, good for you!

JM

[chitownvet]

Thanks all.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

This is probably most properly ruled "weak interference" - kill it, send the runners back, tell the BR he really shouldn't ought to do that.

Could someone offer a quick refresher primer on the definition of "weak interference", the penalty (see quote above?), the source of the rule (it's a Jaska/Roder interpretation, right?), and a couple of typical examples (hitting the catcher with the backswing?). Thanks.

In the OP, it sounds like there was a small possibility that F2 might have had a pickoff play. If so, I would give the benefit of the doubt to the non-offending team, and call BR out for interference.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

chitownvet,

This is probably most properly ruled "weak interference" - kill it, send the runners back, tell the BR he really shouldn't ought to do that.

Of course, if you got an out, and the only one anybody got upset with was the clueless BR, good for you!

JM

I'm going to disagree here. F2 may have had a play on either R# or R2, as they were moving toward home and 3rd respectively. Had it happened after both runners were going back to their bases, realizing they couldn't advance, then maybe weak interference and no penalty. The defense was squawking on the play, which leads me to believe that they thought there was a possible play as well.

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Yes.

[COLOR="Navy"]6.06 (c) He interferes with the catcher’s fielding or throwing by stepping out of the batter’s box or making any other movement that hinders the catcher’s play at home base. EXCEPTION: Batter is not out if any runner attempting to advance is put out, or if runner trying to score is called out for batter’s interference.

Steve Rule 6.06(c) does not apply in this situation

From the OP

The batter takes ball four as the pitch is in the dirt and deflects off the catchers shin guard a little ways down the first base line.

Since the ball got passed F2 B1 is no longer "classified" as a batter but an offensive teammate.

Therefore, the rule governing the situation described in the OP is OBR rule 3.15 Comment

Rule 3.15 Comment: The question of intentional or unintentional interference shall be decided on the basis of the person’s action. If, however, he kicks the ball or picks it up or pushes it, that is considered intentional interference, regardless of what his thought may have been.

Pete Booth

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

chitownvet,

This is probably most properly ruled "weak interference" - kill it, send the runners back, tell the BR he really shouldn't ought to do that.

JM IMO not weak interference. OBR 3.15 covers this situation

Rule 3.15 Comment: The question of intentional or unintentional interference shall be decided on the basis of the person’s action. If, however, he kicks the ball or picks it up or pushes it, that is considered intentional interference, regardless of what his thought may have been.

We are NOT mind readers and the fact that the ball was picked up is deemed intentional interference so I agree with the out call.

Pete Booth

[bob jenkins]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth;610961]

Steve Rule 6.06(c) does not apply in this situation

From the OP



Since the ball got passed F2 B1 is no longer "classified" as a batter but an offensive teammate.

Therefore, the rule governing the situation described in the OP is OBR rule 3.15 Comment




Pete Booth

Sorry, Pete, but 3.15 specifically does not apply to offensive team members participating in the game (meaning batters or runners).

And, even if it did apply, while it's interference, that just means the ball is dead and the umpire imposes whatever bases or outs he wants.

I'd go to 2.00-Interference "...impedes ... any fielder attempting to make a play."

I can read the OP in two ways -- the other runners were sufficiently far enough off the base that there was a play, or the action was (reasonably) relaxed and there wasn't a play. The former is interference (and an out); the other is "weak interference" and put everyone back.

Only the OP can decide, sinc he was there.

[chitownvet]

[QUOTE=bob jenkins;610964]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Sorry, Pete, but 3.15 specifically does not apply to offensive team members participating in the game (meaning batters or runners).

And, even if it did apply, while it's interference, that just means the ball is dead and the umpire imposes whatever bases or outs he wants.

I'd go to 2.00-Interference "...impedes ... any fielder attempting to make a play."

I can read the OP in two ways -- the other runners were sufficiently far enough off the base that there was a play, or the action was (reasonably) relaxed and there wasn't a play. The former is interference (and an out); the other is "weak interference" and put everyone back.

Only the OP can decide, sinc he was there.

Yes, that was the source of my later concern. It was the catchers actions that initially swayed me to call interference and hence the batter/runner out. He rushed to retrieve the ball and as he arrived the ball was handled by the batter/runner. As I said, the runners were NOT heading back to their respective bases, but were not making a mad dash for the next base either. I felt the catcher may have attempted a play, and therefore made the call as I did.

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE][QUOTE=bob jenkins;610964]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Sorry, Pete, but 3.15 specifically does not apply to offensive team members participating in the game (meaning batters or runners).

Bob in a way it does

From the Comment section

PLAY: Batter hits ball to shortstop, who fields ball but throws wild past first baseman. The offensive coach at first base, to avoid being hit by the ball, falls to the ground and the first baseman on his way to retrieve the wild thrown ball, runs into the coach; the batter-runner finally ends up on third base. The question is asked whether the umpire should call interference on the part of the coach. This would be up to the judgment of the umpire and if the umpire felt that the coach did all he could to avoid interfering with the play, no interference need be called. If it appeared to the umpire that the coach was obviously just making it appear he was trying not to interfere, the umpire should rule interference.

IMO, a base coach is an offensive team member. If we put a "twist" on the aforementioned play and say F6 throws the ball wild to F3, the offensive coach picks up the wild throw then we would rule interference.

This OP sounds similar. We had F2 chasing after a loose ball and the on-deck batter (similar to a first base coach) picked up the ball. I think Papa C has a similar type case play in his BRD about the on deck batter except if I recall the on deck batter did not pick up a loose ball as in this OP but collided with F2 chasing after a loose ball. The call was interference.

The on deck batter is not supposed to pick up a live ball.

Pete Booth

[GA Umpire]

I believe 7.08(b) applies here. The BR intentionally interfered with a thrown ball. It does not say if there is a play or not. And, BR is a runner since it was ball 4. So, BR is out for intentional INT on a thrown ball. Even though a pitched ball is treated differently in some cases, I don't believe this is one of them.

So, I still have BR out but for violating the first part of 7.08(b) regardless if there was a play or not on anyone else. And, if it wasn't ball 4, then he would be out for BI, rule 6.06(c) if there was a potential play anywhere(this is where I think weak INT would come in). Basically, he is out for doing it under one of these rules. And even if no runners are on base, he can still be out in this situation since he is a runner intentionally INT with a thrown ball although I won't make that call. He needs to just learn to leave the ball alone.

[johnnyg08]

okay, so lets take this a step further. R3 takes off and is going to be dead at home...B/R picks up the ball, would we ever have a situation like this (similar to OP) where R3 is out or do we still call B/R out and send R3 back to 3B?