Theory behind B and C positions

[bossman72]

I was asked a question about positioning last weekend- "Why with R3 only are we in C position?" I didn't have a good answer and I mentioned something about 'playing the percentages.' He then came back with "Well, why don't we go to B when there's 2 outs since the percentages say that the play is going to be at first?" Once again, I had no answer.

So, I defer my answers for this guy to you guys Why are we in the positions mandated by our mechanics books?

[Kevin Finnerty]

Most of the guys I work with choose between the two based on what we think is most likely to happen, just like your question described.

We go against the book at times.

[zm1283]

I'm only in B with runners on first, first and third, or bases loaded. Everything else is C with runners on. Personally, I don't have a problem making a call on a play at first when I start in C. Just gain some ground toward first and get a good angle and you're fine. I did notice tonight that if a ball is hit to F6 and he has to charge it, you had better be ready to move if you're in C if he is going to throw to first.

[David B]

Originally Posted by bossman72

I was asked a question about positioning last weekend- "Why with R3 only are we in C position?" I didn't have a good answer and I mentioned something about 'playing the percentages.' He then came back with "Well, why don't we go to B when there's 2 outs since the percentages say that the play is going to be at first?" Once again, I had no answer.

So, I defer my answers for this guy to you guys Why are we in the positions mandated by our mechanics books?

Sometimes we have to do what the books request, but most of the time, our groups go with whatever we prefer. I like to stay in B most all of the time.
Some prefer C, but like you stated, I like to be close to the play.

But, I've worked with other groups who mandate move to C.

Playing percentages, what is it, less than 5% of plays at 3rd, so why do we spend so much time worrying about 3rd??

Thanks
David

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by David B

Playing percentages, what is it, less than 5% of plays at 3rd, so why do we spend so much time worrying about 3rd??

Thanks
David

I do not know if the percentages are right, but the reason I have been taught for a long time to be in the B position most of the time. That being said, our mechanics from our state have us in the B position with a runner on third. If I am not mistaken, that is also what the CCA Books says.

Peace

[jkumpire]

I hate to be so old now, I remember "old school stuff"....

The old timers taught me that "being ahead of the runner" is the important thing, that is why many people are in C even with R3. You may say that you can't be ahead of the runner in C, but many times that run is the important runner in the game, and if there is a play on him at #B, it can be a significant play in the game.

The concepts that are so important in teaching mechanics today, like "angle over distance" and "cover the money play" were not as emphasized as they are now. when I went to school in the 1980's neither of these concepts were even discussed.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bossman72

I was asked a question about positioning last weekend- "Why with R3 only are we in C position?" I didn't have a good answer and I mentioned something about 'playing the percentages.' He then came back with "Well, why don't we go to B when there's 2 outs since the percentages say that the play is going to be at first?" Once again, I had no answer.

So, I defer my answers for this guy to you guys Why are we in the positions mandated by our mechanics books?

It's not only the "percentages," it's the time to move, and the type of call.

On a pick to third, the umpire will not have much time to move, already has an angle, and closer will be better for seeing (or at least selling) the tag play -- and most of these will be "close".

On a grounder with a throw to first, the umpire has plenty of time to move, sometimes the play will not be close, and distance doesn't matter as much on a "force play" (sic).

[Umpmazza]

I know I stand with 2 outs in "B"...Im sure I read that in the CCA or the Red Book.

you are also in "C" in cause of a pickoff.

[Klokard]

CCA still has BU (2 man mechanic) in C with 2 outs and R3. It is locally, Conference, MiLB mechanic that allows BU to be in B with R3 and 2 outs.

[chartrusepengui]

newbie question - I've watched 3 games this week. In 2 0f the 3 games - 2 person system, the BU was in C with R1 on first. We follow Fed here. This goes against what the manual says. I asked and was told that they go to C in this sit because they can turn and face first from C at the pitch. they get a "great" angle and have a slim profile to the batter/ball if hit towards them. I was also told that being a rook - I should follow the manual. Is this common?

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by chartrusepengui

newbie question - I've watched 3 games this week. In 2 0f the 3 games - 2 person system, the BU was in C with R1 on first. We follow Fed here. This goes against what the manual says. I asked and was told that they go to C in this sit because they can turn and face first from C at the pitch. they get a "great" angle and have a slim profile to the batter/ball if hit towards them. I was also told that being a rook - I should follow the manual. Is this common?

That's weird, because you do not have the best angle for a pickoff at 1B from C... not sure why those guys are there.

[johnnyg08]

Personally, if you're playing percentages with R1...your odds of play at 2B versus a pickoff at 1B are far greater. I love working C with R1 because I feel it gives me a significantly better angle to make a call on a SB attempt at 2B. HOWEVER...I'm very hesitant to sit in C...sometimes if I see that F1 doesn't have a good move to 1B...I will go to C because if somebody's going to be picked at 1B, the 90 yr old grandma in the stands will be able to see that he's out.

Get in the best angle to see the percentage play..esp w/ 2-man...where you already give up lots of angles.

[David B]

Originally Posted by bossman72

That's weird, because you do not have the best angle for a pickoff at 1B from C... not sure why those guys are there.

I was thinking the same thing. The reasons they give for being in C do not make a lot of sense. You are so much farther from the pickoff especially from F2.

I could see a veteran umpire getting away with it, but for the younger umpires, the coach is going to eat your lunch making the call from that far away.

Thanks
David

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by David B

I could see a veteran umpire getting away with it, but for the younger umpires, the coach is going to eat your lunch making the call from that far away.

The same reasoning applies to why you should be in C with R3. Out here, coaches will wonder why you are in B to see a pick at 3rd. They expect BU to be in C, which sets up a more natural angle to a play behind R3, plus you're a lot closer to the tag play, which is what they want to see.

[PeteBooth]

The use of the metal bat determines where I go.

I have been hit once off of a metal bat and luckily nothing major happened. I felt some pain for a while but nothing earth shattering. I simply had no time to react.

If there is R3 and we have a Right hand power hitter up, I go to B if it's a lefty I go to "C".

In other words I try and go opposite of the persons power alley.

Also, I do not know about the rest of you but when the particpants use metal I am in a much "deeper" position then I would be if wood is used.

Nothing like a good ole fashion wood bat game.

Pete Booth