Player switch to other team...

[TussAgee11]

Walk up to the field 5 minutes prior to a Sr. Babe game. Very relaxed league, dads coaching who realize their kid will not be the next Walter Johnson, overall a good league for kids who don't play HS or legion ball, but still enjoy playing.

Team has 8 kids. I approach HC, and inquire as to the situation. He says 1 player went to the Yankee game, another had to go to the hospital for grandma, but another had left his house and was on his way. I inform him he has 15 minutes from game time to field a team, and we go our separate ways.

Pard and I are standing at the plate talking and waiting. 10 minutes or so pass and I again move over to coach, finding out what the deal is. He says he has a player in the parking lot changing...

2nd inning I realize something is a miss. Both teams were wearing blue vests (one with white under, the other with black). The late arriving player had no undershirt... but his jersey was actually the other teams (not noticeable from afar, but noticeable up close) I talked with partner in between innings and he said that he noticed it too, and asked coach if that player was on his roster. Coach replied that he was.

When he came to the on-deck circle the next inning, I noticed he was wearing the other team's jersey... the inning ended before he came up to bat.

Then, a different player took his place in the field (the kid who actually was running late, which was probably an illegal substitution, but that is a different story). I ran over my options in my head for the next inning when the kid came up to bat.

Let me say that by the time I noticed this, and when I took the following course of action, the kid did not participate in the game. I knew I would have to resolve it before he did.

My options were,

a) Eject HC, Eject Player, Forfeit Game
b) DQ player, chew out coach, leave an out in the lineup, don't let kid enter on the correct team
c) Ignore all together because of the relaxed nature of the league.

I ended up calling the coach over and saying, "Okay Coach, here's the deal. You have told us that this player is on your roster. If he is not, you are assuming all liability for his participation in this game". Coach said okay, and we played on with no further incident. (Actually, after that at-bat, the kid did not play anymore and I noticed his "spot" in the lineup magically disappeared.)

I choose this course of action for 5 reasons. 1) To relieve me and my partner of all liability 2) We really had no way of proving that the player wasn't on that team's roster 3) I wanted to let coach that we weren't idiots and 4) The league is a very relaxed summer league and never has given me any trouble in the ways of incidents, or any partner that I've worked with and 5) Partner was on board with this course of action.

Now, reasons I should not have done this and been more severe... 1) The letter our creed, the rulebook 2) It sets a precedent if this guy pulls this crap again, and could leave a future umpire in trouble.

So, my question is... how would you have handled it? And, the muddier question to the law folk out there, did I indeed pass the buck in terms of liability to the coach?

Feel free to flame... in some ways I probably deserve it, but in other ways I do think I did the right thing. A sticky situation indeed... but that is just my .02 cents. I'm looking for your .013 €

Regards,

Tuss

[RPatrino]

Tuss, I'd be inclined to dump the entire offending team, most of their specatators and any league officials in attendance. They obviously were co-conspirators in this subtrefuge of deceit.

ORRRRRRRRRRRRRRR, you could ignore it and let the players have fun.

[DG]

If one team wants to loan another a player so they can play, and coaches agree, then fine with me. I get no pleasure from getting paid to prevent teams from playing. It usually means a non-starter for one team gets to play an entire game for another, with both team's appreciation for him making this "sacrifice" so they can play.

[TussAgee11]

DG -

My concern is with our association rules on this sort of thing happening... it is not that I get pleasure out of getting paid to not umpire.

There are very strict rules about this sort of thing for liability purposes. Unfortunately that is the world we live in today.

[BigUmp56]

Why in the world would you, as an official, assume any additional liability for allowing this. It's really not your business who is rostered on a team. The liability insurance provider for Babe Ruth insures the players for both practice and games played within their organization. They have no restriction or control over which players play on a particular team.


Tim.

[soundedlikeastrike]

I have to agree, it's not your business.

You may very well a had 17 other, non-rostered players, which you failed to include in your suspicions. Better hope the player you ridiculed, singled out and probably traumatized for life (umpaphobia) wasn't in one of the many protected groups out there, car, house, jet skies, gone....you practically publicly slandered every coach there. Trip to Mex. uh uh..maybe your lawyer.

Line up fella's, cup check.. Do you know the manufacturers torque specifications for the screws mounting a mask..are you ensuring they are correct? What if that mound is 11", that sprinkler head is kinda precarious out there in LC, there's an awful lota rocks on this infield..

"To a reasonable man",, and other court-enese would probably cover ya.

Coaches, are we gonna get enough?
Yep, but we need the grace period..
Okay the clock is ticking.
Coaches, do we have a game, are your players properly equipped and ready to go, what ever else you blah, blah about..
Yep.
Take the field..

In court, tell it like it is, your honor on this date at XX @ XY I was dspatched to XX to call a game, I did that.
I asked coaches for official line ups at game time, they gave em to me, we commenced.

We are not league administrators, IMO. If you're that worried, note your suspicions in the official scorebook, spit handshake with your pard and get to work..

Your association requires proof of eligibilty at every game?

If somebody say's a word to me about non rostered players; then we have an issue that I'll take on, other wise uh uh. I will certainly double check with the league on "like uni's etc" via my assignor for future reference, but we got two teams that say they are ready to go, we're going..

[SanDiegoSteve]

As long as both teams agree to the loaning of the player(s), I've never prohibited it in a youth ball game. If it were for the league championship, no they couldn't do it, but that's unlikely to happen in a league championship game.

Now if one team only has nine, and the other is short a player or more, then we have a good old fashioned forfeit on our hands. There has to be enough subs on the team that is loaning the player(s). I would not let them use starters.

And if a team has an ejection that brings them down to eight players, game over.

[bob jenkins]

Some leagues allow this "loaning", some don't -- you need to find the specific rules.

If not allowed and it turns into a "scrimmage", some insurance covers it, some doesnt -- again, you need to find out (I'm 99% certain that the NASO insurance covers it).

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Some leagues allow this "loaning", some don't -- you need to find the specific rules.

He said it was Babe Ruth, Bob. It's allowed under a blanket participation coverage................


Tim.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

As long as both teams agree to the loaning of the player(s), I've never prohibited it in a youth ball game. If it were for the league championship, no they couldn't do it, but that's unlikely to happen in a league championship game.

Now if one team only has nine, and the other is short a player or more, then we have a good old fashioned forfeit on our hands. There has to be enough subs on the team that is loaning the player(s). I would not let them use starters.

And if a team has an ejection that brings them down to eight players, game over.

I am not such a red *** in these recreational leagues. We have one just like this.

We play with 7-8 players if necessary, we let them loan players to other teams, who cares? The kids that are there want to play and nobody gives us any grief. Easiest $40 for a 2-hour time limit I've ever made.

[crewumpires]

I think you handled well. Being a relaxed league... I also think it was wise to bring it up to the coaches however. We have a similar league that plays mainly for fun and we allow pretty much any subs to field a team as long as they are signed up in the league and have filled out the waiver etc...

[DG]

Originally Posted by TussAgee11

My concern is with our association rules on this sort of thing happening... it is not that I get pleasure out of getting paid to not umpire.

There are very strict rules about this sort of thing for liability purposes. Unfortunately that is the world we live in today.

I have never belonged to an association that concerns itself with player eligibility. If the coaches agree to a player swap and answer my one and only question with a YES, we can play.