Bob Jenkins at the Plate

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by chuckfan1

.....I guess you dont get dinged for it because you have Senior Veteran Grandfather Status due to your "many many years", but should really consider losing the double-safe mechanic. Does that mean he is safe twice? Or he wasnt just safe, but really really safe? He is either safe or not.
Seems like I saw it a couple times on there. Which means it loses its emphasis the more you bust it out.

Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha-Ha!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that's funny!

Originally Posted by chuckfan1

...And I concur with the one guy about that called 3rd strike at the end. We all miss a pitch, but thats a "gross" miss. And in a championship game? Not pretty.

(Still laughing from before) and your championship looks, how?

[David B]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I think you are confusing FED rules in other sports with baseball. It is not technically illegal to use an air horn or any other form of an artificial sound maker.

Peace

You are correct, thanks for the heads up.


thanks
David

[RPatrino]

Lose the 'double safe' mechanic?? Not a chance. I may use the 'triple safe' in it's place.

Tee, isn't one of the ADVANTAGES of the 3 man is being able to have someone go out on every fly ball? What was the evaluator talking about on this one?

[Tim C]

"Tee, isn't one of the ADVANTAGES of the 3 man is being able to have someone go out on every fly ball? What was the evaluator talking about on this one?"

Oregon uses "Modified Oregon Mechanics" (3 man for this game).

"Modified Oregon Mechanics" closely follow those mechanics as prescribed by the CCA manual.

The CCA manual has notes that precludes umpires "going out on every fly ball" by stating that a read should be done first. The PBUC manual encourages an umpire to be out on all fly balls -- "Modified Oregon" wants a read done.

All that being said the ball was not a fly ball but a hard ground ball. Since there was no "catch/no catch" or "converging fielders" the evaluator saw no reason to go out. Once I explained "why" I went out he was totally in agreement.

As I noted earlier I do wish I had given a "safe" signal after the ball bounced away from the wall.

Regards,

[ODJ]

Originally Posted by Chris_Hickman

Whether you use CCA or PRO 3 man mechanics. Umpires don't go out on base hits to the outfield unless it's a fair/foul. Nobody on base and you have a base hit to RF...U1 is still responsible for the ball going out of play..fan interference etc. but does not need to go out. The notion of having 3 umps justifies going out on a base hit is not valid reasoning IMHO. Not pickin on Tim.. I just wanted the posters to know the actual mechanics of 3 man.

So when U1 moves to watch the B/R touch first, the eyes in the back of his head are to watch the ball bounce near fans, fences, etc?

[RPatrino]

Chris, we have 3 warm bodies, I say let's send one out to cover that ball heading toward DBT and the fans, just to be safe.

[JJ]

I was watching Bob Jenkins work that plate game, and he did a great job. His whole crew worked VERY well together and it truly was umpired as a "championship game". The ejection was quick and was the result of the batter using a poor choice of words to express his dislike about that called third strike. Of course, he had no comment on the first two strikes, which he also missed.
Oh, the ballpark food was good, too!

JJ

[socalblue1]

Originally Posted by Chris_Hickman

According to Tim this was a base hit that was 15 feet from the line that did not need a fair/foul decision. If that's the case, you dont go out. Now just because you don't go out that doesn't mean you stop umpiring. If for some crazy reason that routine base hit heads towards the corner or to a fence, you still have to umpire that ball...... I am just saying.... this was a routine base hit. No need to go out.

Chris,

Some fields have blind areas in the corners that a line drive or hard ground ball base hit could get into. If we have three umpires and no runner why take a chance? Go out far enough so U1 never losses site of the ball. PU can easily pick up the touch and potential play back into 1B.

Of course this needs to be discussed during the pre-game.

[canadaump6]

Thank you for the reply Tee. I will bring up in my association the idea of base umpire calling the tag/no tag at the 45 foot lane.

Chris, that wasn't me who wore the wristbands. I would die before I ever did that.

[chuckfan1]

Once again you show your true colors..
As far as my championships? 1st and 2nd round this year, and Orange County Calif High School All Star Game...championships?..maybe next year. But hey, thanks for asking.

[RPatrino]

Chris, in Tee's case, he determined there was a valid reason to go out on that ground ball to the outfield. Normally, you are correct, there is no need to go out on a routine base hit. Note the word , "routine". I'd rather err on the side of misjudging something as "trouble", rather then judging it as "routine" and having it turn into a problem. Just my preference, do as you wish.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Chris, in Tee's case, he determined there was a valid reason to go out on that ground ball to the outfield. Normally, you are correct, there is no need to go out on a routine base hit. Note the word , "routine". I'd rather err on the side of misjudging something as "trouble", rather then judging it as "routine" and having it turn into a problem. Just my preference, do as you wish.

For me, it depends on the field.

If it's enclosed with no fence gaps and no chance of spectator interference, I'm signaling fair and staying in the infield (either rotating home or sliding depending on the number and location of baserunners).

If there's a DBT line or a bad fence or a chance of interference, I'm going with it. It's far more credible having an umpire on it rather than having a plate umpire calling something from 300 feet or more away. We'll talk about this when we walk the field as part of our pregame.

Tee can address exactly why he found it necessary to follow the ball. I think it would be instructive and would give us his line of reasoning, so I hope he replies.

[Tim C]

This may take a little time:

We had an extensive pre-game over lunch and discussed many, many things.

Because of state training we DO NOT go out on all fly balls. (PBUC goes out on all fly balls with three man crew and CCA does not). At our pre-game we talked extensively about going out when needed especially if the number of umpires left were equal to or greater than the runners.

We were told that the field was fully enclosed. The only areas of concern were the tarp area and both bullpens.

Because of the tight game schedule we DID NOT walk around the field (we did do this at all other local playoff games) and check for “difficult” areas.

Now the play and my thinking:

The play was in the top of the first inning in the Oregon 6A State Championship Game. The ball was hit hard by a right handed batter and it squirreled between F3 and the first base bag. It was clearly NOT a fair/foul type ball.

As I turned to pause and read I saw the ball slicing towards the RF corner. I also noticed at that instant that there was a banner hanging from the inside of the fence. I determined at that time that with a single batter runner and two additional umpires that it would look extremely bad if some how, when that rapidly moving ground ball hit the bottom support of the fence, if it hopped up behind the banner there would need to be a call.

I decided at that time this was a potential "trouble ball."

I decided to go out at that point.

One runner. Two umpires. It seemed logical too me.

Again, I WISH I had given a “SAFE” sign when the ball bounced off the fence and came back to the fielder. Other than that I have no reason to question the decision I made.

Question to all of you:

Was what I did "bad"?

The 20 or so High School umpires in attendence seemed satidfied that I made a decision and stuck with it (there were also comments about my speed surprising them since I am a "Fat and OLD" man).

What are the negative possibilities tied to my going out (please note the PU did fill in behind me as mechanics dictate)?

[Rich]

You know I'm not questioning your decision here - I just knew it would show that there was a reason you went and that all of the back-seat umpires who question such things should just listen

I agree: Bases empty? No brainer, go with the ball. If two umpires can't handle one runner, then they don't belong on this game. If there's a tarp and bullpens and banners that can cause problems, well, then just go.

Now, to continue, if it was R1+R2, would you have gone? (I find this question more interesting actually, since going on your play is really a no-brainer once you now the bases were empty).

[TussAgee11]

Originally Posted by Tim C

This may take a little time:

We had an extensive pre-game over lunch and discussed many, many things.

Because of state training we DO NOT go out on all fly balls. (PBUC goes out on all fly balls with three man crew and CCA does not). At our pre-game we talked extensively about going out when needed especially if the number of umpires left were equal to or greater than the runners.

We were told that the field was fully enclosed. The only areas of concern were the tarp area and both bullpens.

Because of the tight game schedule we DID NOT walk around the field (we did do this at all other local playoff games) and check for “difficult” areas.

Now the play and my thinking:

The play was in the top of the first inning in the Oregon 6A State Championship Game. The ball was hit hard by a right handed batter and it squirreled between F3 and the first base bag. It was clearly NOT a fair/foul type ball.

As I turned to pause and read I saw the ball slicing towards the RF corner. I also noticed at that instant that there was a banner hanging from the inside of the fence. I determined at that time that with a single batter runner and two additional umpires that it would look extremely bad if some how, when that rapidly moving ground ball hit the bottom support of the fence, if it hopped up behind the banner there would need to be a call.

I decided at that time this was a potential "trouble ball."

I decided to go out at that point.

One runner. Two umpires. It seemed logical too me.

Again, I WISH I had given a “SAFE” sign when the ball bounced off the fence and came back to the fielder. Other than that I have no reason to question the decision I made.

Question to all of you:

Was what I did "bad"?

The 20 or so High School umpires in attendence seemed satidfied that I made a decision and stuck with it (there were also comments about my speed surprising them since I am a "Fat and OLD" man).

What are the negative possibilities tied to my going out (please note the PU did fill in behind me as mechanics dictate)?

Makes sense to me... all you are giving up is YOUR look at a touch of first base, an F3 OBS, or a long round and retreat to 1st with a snap throw behind the runner.

Yes, those things may be more likely to happen than a ball in a banner, but they are all things that PU should be able to see coming up the line or have time to get in position for. The ball in the banner, not so sure your PU would be looking for that if you came in...