Pitcher taking signals.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

NFHS Rules only for now.

R6-S1-A1 states that: He [the pitcher] shall take his sign from the catcher with his pivot foot in contact with the pitcher’s plate.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

MTD, Sr.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

NFHS Rules only for now.

R6-S1-A1 states that: He [the pitcher] shall take his sign from the catcher with his pivot foot in contact with the pitcher’s plate.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

MTD, Sr.

Supposedly by FED rules it a balk. This rule is basically a deterrent against the quick pitch. I'm not looking for anything like this. Very poorly worded in the FED rule book in my estimation. You will get many varying opinions on this subject.

[ozzy6900]

I do not know when F1 is getting his signs from F2, nor do I care! The rules (under all 3 codes) are there to prevent F1 from quick pitching to the batter.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

I do not know when F1 is getting his signs from F2, nor do I care! The rules (under all 3 codes) are there to prevent F1 from quick pitching to the batter.

Ozzy:

Reread my original play. F1 did not quick pitch. F1 took signals from F2 while in contact with the rubber before starting his pitching motion. How is this quick pitching?

MTD, Sr.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Ozzy:

Reread my original play. F1 did not quick pitch. F1 took signals from F2 while in contact with the rubber before starting his pitching motion. How is this quick pitching?

MTD, Sr.

I reread your play. You said originally that F1 took signs while straddling the rubber. Now you said he was in contact. Which is it?

Either way, if no quick pitch was involved, it's a "don't do that." (regardless of what the "rule" says.) Send F2 out to the mound to tell Bozo to take his signs from on the rubber so everyone will be happy campers. Sometimes I'll just tell the catcher not to give the pitcher his sign until he gets on the rubber, and usually F1 gets the hint.

Like Ozzy said, I don't see when the catcher gives the sign, nor do I care if he did or didn't get a sign at all, as long as he doesn't just step on the rubber quickly and quick pitch the batter.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I reread your play. You said originally that F1 took signs while straddling the rubber. Now you said he was in contact. Which is it?

Either way, if no quick pitch was involved, it's a "don't do that." (regardless of what the "rule" says.) Send F2 out to the mound to tell Bozo to take his signs from on the rubber so everyone will be happy campers. Sometimes I'll just tell the catcher not to give the pitcher his sign until he gets on the rubber, and usually F1 gets the hint.

Like Ozzy said, I don't see when the catcher gives the sign, nor do I care if he did or didn't get a sign at all, as long as he doesn't just step on the rubber quickly and quick pitch the batter.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I reread your play. You said originally that F1 took signs while straddling the rubber. Now you said he was in contact. Which is it?

Either way, if no quick pitch was involved, it's a "don't do that." (regardless of what the "rule" says.) Send F2 out to the mound to tell Bozo to take his signs from on the rubber so everyone will be happy campers. Sometimes I'll just tell the catcher not to give the pitcher his sign until he gets on the rubber, and usually F1 gets the hint.

Like Ozzy said, I don't see when the catcher gives the sign, nor do I care if he did or didn't get a sign at all, as long as he doesn't just step on the rubber quickly and quick pitch the batter.

Steve,
When are you going to hit him with a balk - when he takes signs while off the rubber - OK, but I'm not sure that's great management. Denucci goes on to say that once F1 is on the rubber, he takes signs from F2. From my standpoint, I don't really care what he does off the rubber in this case, I do care what he does while on the rubber. Granted, this is coming from someone who is primarily softball - so many nuances are lost - but I think that in this case, I only care what happens when he is on the rubber.

[David Emerling]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I reread your play. You said originally that F1 took signs while straddling the rubber. Now you said he was in contact. Which is it?

Either way, if no quick pitch was involved, it's a "don't do that." (regardless of what the "rule" says.) Send F2 out to the mound to tell Bozo to take his signs from on the rubber so everyone will be happy campers. Sometimes I'll just tell the catcher not to give the pitcher his sign until he gets on the rubber, and usually F1 gets the hint.

Like Ozzy said, I don't see when the catcher gives the sign, nor do I care if he did or didn't get a sign at all, as long as he doesn't just step on the rubber quickly and quick pitch the batter.

I like the way the ASA (Amateur Softball Association) addresses this. It says that the pitcher must be in contact with the rubber and "appear" to be getting signs from the catcher. Essentially, there must be some kind of pause once the pitcher engages the rubber. Obviously, this is to prevent a quick pitch.

The umpire needn't concern himself when, or if, the pitcher is getting the signal from the catcher, as long as there is the appearance of getting a sign.

I would apply the same philosophy to baseball. As long as there is a reasonable pause once the pitcher engages the rubber - I don't really care WHEN or IF he gets signals. No quick pitch ... no violation.

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Ozzy:

Reread my original play. F1 did not quick pitch. F1 took signals from F2 while in contact with the rubber before starting his pitching motion. How is this quick pitching?

MTD, Sr.

Sigh! Here, Mark, I'll do a cut and paste for you.......

NFHS Rules only for now.

R6-S1-A1 states that: He [the pitcher] shall take his sign from the catcher with his pivot foot in contact with the pitcher’s plate.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

MTD, Sr.

I have no more time for this!

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

I do not know when F1 is getting his signs from F2, nor do I care! The rules (under all 3 codes) are there to prevent F1 from quick pitching to the batter.

Okay, so I fibbed. Onen more.

Ozzy, what's so mysterious about BU in B or C seeing F1 leaning in to take signs when not in contact with the rubber? Are you assuming that the PU would be doing this?

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Okay, so I fibbed. Onen more.

Ozzy, what's so mysterious about BU in B or C seeing F1 leaning in to take signs when not in contact with the rubber? Are you assuming that the PU would be doing this?

I would be more concerned about a possible pick off.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Okay, so I fibbed. Onen more.

Ozzy, what's so mysterious about BU in B or C seeing F1 leaning in to take signs when not in contact with the rubber? Are you assuming that the PU would be doing this?

Nothing mysterious, Garth. I've made this statement over and over here and on other boards.

• I do not care about the signs.
• I do not know when the signs are given to the pitcher. The catcher could be flexing his fingers for all I know! Maybe he is signaling the pitcher for a date! What the hell do I care!
• I only care about the quick pitch.

I know that you understand what I am saying here.

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

NFHS Rules only for now.

R6-S1-A1 states that: He [the pitcher] shall take his sign from the catcher with his pivot foot in contact with the pitcher’s plate.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

MTD, Sr.

Define "signals".

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by fitump56

Define "signals".

fitump is on the right track. You can't define signals. If you have a first and third situation, and the catcher steps up and goes through his gyrations for the infield, is that a signal? Yup. If he goes down and taps his shinguard for pick-off, is that a signal? Yes sir it is.

This is a poorly worded rule, that FED, in it's never surprising stupidity, adopted from OBR. If there was one part of OBR that didn't need to be moved over it was this one. Dumb, and dumber.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

NFHS Rules only for now.

R6-S1-A1 states that: He [the pitcher] shall take his sign from the catcher with his pivot foot in contact with the pitcher’s plate.

Play: R1 and the F1 stradles the rubber with the ball in his pitching hand and looks at F2 who gives him some pitching signals. F1 then engages the rubber and again takes pitching signals from F2. Has F1 committed a balk?

MTD, Sr.

My beleif (and no, I don't have anything to support this), is that the rule, at least in FED, is to help the runners know when F1 is on (or off) the rubber. So. If F1 is straddling the rubber, bent over, peering in at F2 and F2 is in a crouch and holding down fingers between his legs -- it's a balk (by rule). If f1 is straddling the rubber, but standing up,. and F2 is out in front flashing the defense for the R1-R3 play, then it's not a balk.