Smittyisms

[BretMan]

Interesting thread. It just so happens that I'm reading it as I'm watching a rare afternoon game, Chicago at Cleveland.

The White Sox had a runner on second who attempted a steal of third. The throw beat the runner by a wide margin. F5 had the glove down on the ground as the runner started his slide directly into the bag.

"Yes!", I'm thinking. "He's out by a mile!". (I'm an Indians fan.)

My, ummm, expectations were quickly quelched by a big safe signal from the third base umpire. Replays showed that the tag was missed, with the runner sliding about six inches to the side of the outstretched glove.

So I guess the Major League umpire making that call can expect his walking papers any day now?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Interesting thread. It just so happens that I'm reading it as I'm watching a rare afternoon game, Chicago at Cleveland.

The White Sox had a runner on second who attempted a steal of third. The throw beat the runner by a wide margin. F5 had the glove down on the ground as the runner started his slide directly into the bag.

"Yes!", I'm thinking. "He's out by a mile!". (I'm an Indians fan.)

My, ummm, expectations were quickly quelched by a big safe signal from the third base umpire. Replays showed that the tag was missed, with the runner sliding about six inches to the side of the outstretched glove.

So I guess the Major League umpire making that call can expect his walking papers any day now?

Did you actually read the thread? Seriously, you did not read this entire thread at all did you?

Not only might did the replay likely show what you suggested, but they are working 4 man mechanics. Every play at a based or a plate there is an umpire all over the damn play.

Peace

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by BretMan

So I guess the Major League umpire making that call can expect his walking papers any day now?

Why would you think that? I haven't read any post in this thread that recommended that an out call would be appropriate in the play you describe.

[Mike L]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Interesting thread.

what's really interesting is the number of umpires who will argue for calling what is expected by players/coaches/and (heaven forbid) fans who will just as gleefully post in other topics how little the players/coaches/fans know about the rules and the functions of umpiring.

Originally Posted by Mike L

what's really interesting is the number of umpires who will argue for calling what is expected by players/coaches/and (heaven forbid) fans who will just as gleefully post in other topics how little the players/coaches/fans know about the rules and the functions of umpiring.

Indeed!!!

[JRutledge]

What is interesting how people on this board (usually newer) that take one comment from one situation and applying it to another situation that is not related to the original topic.

Peace

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

What is interesting how people on this board (usually newer) that take one comment from one situation and applying it to another situation that is not related to the original topic.

Peace

Indeed

[BretMan]

Yes, I really did read every post on this thread. Seriously!

Did you seriously not see the little blue smiley that, according to the tags, equates to "sarcasm"?

I don't post here often, but have read just about every thread on this board since I joined three years ago. If that makes me a "newbie"...then I guess I'm a newbie!

This isn't my first exposure to the whole "expected call" debate. Responses here ranged from "that's an out" to "that's not an out". Some say that there has been a big change in how MLB umpires make the "expected call", others claim it's business as usual. Both sides of the fence were pretty well covered.

And one post most certainly did imply that a professional umpire was dismissed for making a call other than the "expected" one.

Along the way, there was a dose of chest thumping and a dash of name calling. Which, of course, doesn't really prove that I read anything. That applies to most every other thread on the board.

[ozzy6900]

Just came back from my game today. Four man crew (State semi-finals 18U) and I was U1. R1 with a huge secondary lead and F1 has R1 dead to nuts. R1 dives back, tag down but R1's fingers had the bag first. "Safe! Safe!" F3 looks at me like I just stabbed him in the heart. Defensive coach steps out and screams, "How is that possible? Sir, can I appeal that call to you?" Fans are going BS!

Coach comes to me and again asks, "How?". "Fingers got to the bag before the tag, coach. You had the runner dead but he was faster. Gotta call it fair, right coach?" Coach looks at me, smiles and says, "Okay Mario, I'll get my runners to grow their fingernails by the next half!" Fans still ticked off but F3 heard the explanation and he was okay with it. Coach was a perfect gentleman from then on also.

Fans were still complaining about the call for the rest of the inning, but that is the difference of being right there as opposed to being 100' away. Here was a perfect situation were if I called what was expected, I would have screwed the player. Personally, I'd rather screw the fans than the players.

Regards

[jkumpire]

I was at that Sox-Indians game today, Section 153, Row Z, seat 9. That's about 20-25 rows from the field, on the 3B foul line, about half way up the line.

The guy from Chicago beat the throw to 3B, no matter what angle the TV monitor showed you on STO. It was an easy call for Tim Chetah, the 3B umpire to make. He stole the base on F1, Martinez would not have thrown him out if he had a cannon instead of an arm. I had him safe from my angle, and I had a great one to watch the play. The foot was on the back of the bag before Blake got the ball there. It was not a bad throw at all, but the expected call would be safe.

[BretMan]

That's not how it looked on the STO multiple replays, slow mo's and tight zooms.

They also showed Eric Wedge's perplexed and agitated reaction in the dugout. My impression was that the call didn't meet his expectations.

But, hey, you were there (lucky dog!), I wasn't, and as the spectators always let us know the view from the stands is always the best view in the house!

[jkumpire]

Sadly, STO had no camera view of the play from a 90 deg angle to the throw, and the 3B ump would block out the camera from the LF foul pole/line.

I had almost the same view as the Indians dugout would have seen it from, and Wedge was down 4 runs at the time, he wouldn't like anything but out in that case. To my eye it weas an easy safe call, the ball did not beat R2 to the bag by any margin for a tag to get down. I amy look at a game replay tonight or tomorrow to see what STO showed.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Yes, I really did read every post on this thread. Seriously!

Did you seriously not see the little blue smiley that, according to the tags, equates to "sarcasm"?

I don't post here often, but have read just about every thread on this board since I joined three years ago. If that makes me a "newbie"...then I guess I'm a newbie!

This isn't my first exposure to the whole "expected call" debate. Responses here ranged from "that's an out" to "that's not an out". Some say that there has been a big change in how MLB umpires make the "expected call", others claim it's business as usual. Both sides of the fence were pretty well covered.

And one post most certainly did imply that a professional umpire was dismissed for making a call other than the "expected" one.

Along the way, there was a dose of chest thumping and a dash of name calling. Which, of course, doesn't really prove that I read anything. That applies to most every other thread on the board.

I saw a similar situation last night in the Texas/Oakland game. Kenny Lofton hits the first pitch of the game over the head of Shannon Stewart in left field. Lofton wants to stretch it into a triple. Throw comes in to Bobby Crosby and he turns and throws to Marco Scutaro, which beats the runner. Lofton goes in head first and avoids tag. Ed Montague (PU) makes the safe call. From the overhead shot behind home plate, Lofton looked out. Replays show the tag was missed. A's manager comes out for brief argument. No reaction from Scutaro. He must have felt it was good call.

I did see a weird mechanic from Montague later in the game. Ball goes down into right field corner. Gerald Laird is going all the way from first. Throw comes in to cutoff man in foul territory. It is a good relay to Matt Suzuki at home. Close play, but Laird slides in safe. I see Montague and he is about eight feet up the third base line making the call from right inside fair territory. That's a new one on me.

[RPatrino]

I think what you saw was a 4 man rotation, R1 and a shot into right field. U1 goes out, R2 rotates toward 1b, U3 rotates to 2b, PU rotates up toward 3rd, I think...(trying to recall my 4 man). PU was coming back to take the play at the plate, in fair territory.

I'm sure someone will skewer me if I'm wrong.

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

Just came back from my game today. Four man crew (State semi-finals 18U) and I was U1. R1 with a huge secondary lead and F1 has R1 dead to nuts. R1 dives back, tag down but R1's fingers had the bag first. "Safe! Safe!" F3 looks at me like I just stabbed him in the heart. Defensive coach steps out and screams, "How is that possible? Sir, can I appeal that call to you?" Fans are going BS!

Coach comes to me and again asks, "How?". "Fingers got to the bag before the tag, coach. You had the runner dead but he was faster. Gotta call it fair, right coach?" Coach looks at me, smiles and says, "Okay Mario, I'll get my runners to grow their fingernails by the next half!" Fans still ticked off but F3 heard the explanation and he was okay with it. Coach was a perfect gentleman from then on also.

You seriously think I am going to believe this really happened as you quote it? Why would you carry on with a coach in such a way (especially the red highlighted above)?

Fans were still complaining about the call for the rest of the inning, but that is the difference of being right there as opposed to being 100' away. Here was a perfect situation were if I called what was expected, I would have screwed the player. Personally, I'd rather screw the fans than the players.

Regards

So you see your role as screwing somebody?