Critique, Please

[CraigD]

Mr. Booth,

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

[/B]

One more for me because I simply do not understand your logic.

You're making this harder than necessary. The two societies we are comparing are different. That's all. I have no doubt that in America, it is likely that the police would have been called, or a civil suit filed later. However, that isn't the normal way of handling things here, and it hasn't always been that way in America either. If I'm not mistaken, you are old enough and experienced enough to know that there was a time in America when every guy brandishing a baseball bat with the intent to harm wasn't prosecuted. If his team mates tackled him and settled him down and nobody was hurt, it was over with. That's what happened here. End of story.

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Here's the question for you. In the heat of the moment if this player was not tackled by someone etc. What were his attentions by bolting onto the field with a bat? What was he going to do with that bat? Obviosuly it was not to hit a baseball. At that moment the players intentions were most likely to cause harm otherwise why rush onto the field with a bat.

I gather from those who were there that had he not been tackled he likely would have caused great harm to the opposing team's coach. Thankfully, it didn't get that far and, in the end, no one was hurt.

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

IMO, that player is lucky at least if this were the US that criminal charges were not pressed.

Also, it is a flat out joke to only have a one game suspension for this act.

On these two points we are in total agreement.

All that's left now is to get through the final game tomorrow evening without an incident. I have the plate again and will likely start the game with an official warning.

[DG]

Originally Posted by CraigD

However, that isn't the normal way of handling things here, and it hasn't always been that way in America either. If I'm not mistaken, you are old enough and experienced enough to know that there was a time in America when every guy brandishing a baseball bat with the intent to harm wasn't prosecuted. If his team mates tackled him and settled him down and nobody was hurt, it was over with. That's what happened here. End of story.

I don't remember a time when a bat swinging guy was not hauled away. Whether he was prosecuted afterwards is out of my hands.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by CraigD

Mr. Booth,

If I'm not mistaken, you are old enough and experienced enough to know that there was a time in America when every guy brandishing a baseball bat with the intent to harm wasn't prosecuted. If his team mates tackled him and settled him down and nobody was hurt, it was over with. That's what happened here. End of story.

Anyone threatening bodily harm with a baseball bat is removed from the game immediately. In most most leagues, he will receive additional penalties. I've never seen it played out as you suggest.

As far as "prosecution" goes, that will depend on the wishes of the victim.

Bottom line, by any standard, you let too much go in your games.

[CraigD]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Anyone threatening bodily harm with a baseball bat is removed from the game immediately. In most most leagues, he will receive additional penalties.

That is exactly what happened. Most have said that the additional penalty he received was too light. No argument from me about that.

Originally Posted by GarthB

I've never seen it played out as you suggest.

Well, I guess your experiences have been different than mine.

I suppose none of you have ever seen an argument in a bar or pool hall in which one patron threatened another patron with a pool cue, but when things were stopped short of an actual physical altercation, everybody walked away without the intervention of the police or the courts.

I've seen the same kind of thing at baseball and softball games in the 70's and 80's in Texas and Oklahoma. Apparently, I grew up in a dramatically different environment than some of you.

Originally Posted by GarthB

Bottom line, by any standard, you let too much go in your games.

Thanks for your critique.

[Steven Tyler]

CraigD,

Apparently, you handled it better than plate umpire in the Padres/Cubs game yesterday who just sat on his thumbs after Chris Young hit Derek Lee.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Steven Tyler

CraigD,

Apparently, you handled it better than plate umpire in the Padres/Cubs game yesterday who just sat on his thumbs after Chris Young hit Derek Lee.

Yes, Mark Everett should have escorted Lee all the way to first base, and not allowed him to talk smack to Young, who did not intentionally hit him. I mean, why would Lee think Young would want to hit him when Young was pitching a perfect game with a 2-2 count on him?

You could tell by Young's initial reaction that he was upset with himself for hitting Lee. Then Lee was allowed to walk out toward Young and say something. Young isn't going to back down, and then got Sunday punched by Lee. Then Young gets tossed for defending himself. That whole thing could have been prevented by the umpires, but they sat back and let it happen.

Then on top of that, they throw Jake Peavy out for tackling Lee to prevent him from doing any more damage, but allow Zambrano to stay in the game after punching several people, and going berserk until someone corralled him.

Gerry Davis and his crew handled the situation miserably.

[Don Mueller]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Yes, Mark Everett should have escorted Lee all the way to first base, and not allowed him to talk smack to Young, who did not intentionally hit him. I mean, why would Lee think Young would want to hit him when Young was pitching a perfect game with a 2-2 count on him? .

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't you the one saying Lilly intentionally hit Renteria? He also had a perfect game going.

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Then on top of that, they throw Jake Peavy out for tackling Lee to prevent him from doing any more damage, but allow Zambrano to stay in the game after punching several people, and going berserk until someone corralled him.

Gerry Davis and his crew handled the situation miserably.

Maybe because Peavy publicly announced that if he was pitching he would retaliate and then poof there he was tackling Lee. Hard to make the argument that he was a peacemaker.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't you the one saying Lilly intentionally hit Renteria? He also had a perfect game going.

Two outs in the first inning and hits the third batter and it ruined the perfect game? Wow Don, that is really lame.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

Maybe because Peavy publicly announced that if he was pitching he would retaliate and then poof there he was tackling Lee. Hard to make the argument that he was a peacemaker.

I did not ever say that 1) Peavy was acting as peacemaker, or 2) that Peavy should not have been ejected, or 3) that he did not tackle Lee. I said that he tackled Lee to prevent Lee from doing any more damage than he already had.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by SAump

You can't expect one of four individuals to control this type of situation.
Even hockey, as violent as any sport, has some type of penalty in place.
Look at superstar LeBron James' one game suspension in the NBA Finals.
Mr James, who didn't fight, was punished as severely as the combatants.
MLB must implement a penalty for leaving the bench to join a melee.
MLB has been considering action to stop brawls for the last 20 years.

Worst of all, is your innocent description of Mr. Peavy's actions.
Mr. Peavy was the first person to cross the Cubs line of machismo.
Mr. Peavy snuck up behind his intended target and clamped down on him.
This may have led to injuries as bystanders stumbled over their bodies.
Others engaged in fighting may have been influenced by Mr. Peavy's actions.
Mr Peavy's actions deserve to be punished more severely than any other.

The Cubs manager, trying to protect Lee, could not control the rush of his teammates behind him.
Watch poor Lee, who you derile, run towards his teammates the minute things began to overheat.
Everything yesterday played out the way it has been sanctioned by MLB.
80% of the players didn't belong on the field.
MLB won't stop it.

This post proves beyond a doubt that you are certifiably nuts.

Peavy was ejected for tackling Lee to keep him from throwing more punches. He was just standing up for his buddy. I didn't say Peavy should not have been run, just that Zambrano was a worse offender, and he should have been dumped as well.

Lee threw a cheap sucker punch at Young. Poor Lee? What are you talking about? Yeah, he took off running away as soon as he realized he was about to get his butt kicked.

80% of the players didn't belong on the field? It was a BENCH CLEARING BRAWL! I don't know how many you have seen in your born days, but they usually involve 100% of the players, the managers, coaches, bat boys, and ball girls ( I wish!).

Oh, and attention all Cubs fans:

If an elderly couple (or anyone else for that matter) does not wish to participate in your silly little ritual of throwing back opponents home run balls, do not resort to assaulting them, harassing them, or knocking their caps off their heads. The behavior exhibited by that dumb blond twit in the bleachers today is just typical of the boorish behavior I have witnessed over the years from pasty-faced Cub fans here at Padres games.

Try to understand that the rest of the sporting world thinks your little tradition of throwing back a perfectly good souvenir is stupid and childish.

End of rant.

[SAump]

States that F2 distracted U1 after HBP and both were surprised to see punches.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports...s17padres.html
More of the same: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=270616116

Melee took the focus off great pitching and great baseball.
Happy to read the strangler was ejected too.
Now there we have possible trade bait for Boston.