Can "FOUL" be made "FAIR"?

[umpduck11]

Originally Posted by BigTex

The OP also didn't tell us that:

I did not want to get into this but… let me describe him to you... the pu wore a backwards cap, wore an inside protector – outside and kakis shorts.

I was just trying to point out that we may not have all the information when we start to throw other umpires under the bus. Now that we have more information, maybe the plate guy should have started out under the bus.

It seems to me that while PU may not have actually been under the bus, his head MAY have been up the gas pipe.......

[ctblu40]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

You're kidding, right? You're not on drugs, are you? Are your arm bands on too tight?

This is why I continue to read this forum!

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

LOL! no my arm bands aren't on too tight & no I'm not on drugs. I was reading in the book Plate Work which in a NASO book. I was reading general principles (4-1) & under diagram 4-1B it shows up the "V" diagram for who covers fly balls & also (i assumed, which I will never do again b/c it makes an a$$ out of you & me, fair/foul balls). I just got to do what DonInKansas said. By the way I never thought it was always the BU always has fair/foul calls. Hmm learn something new everyday.

Good, at least you are reading!

The "V" is for fly ball coverage. In a 2 man system, the only time the BU gets to call anything fair or foul is when there are no runners on and he is in the "A" position. The PU takes the call from the plate to the 1st bas bag and the BU gets the call from the 1st base bag down the line to the pole.

*******READ CAREFULLY********

When the BU is in "B" or "C" position, he has no business making any calls on the lines. The PU takes all fair and foul calls when the BU is "in".

The only exception is "foul in the box" that the PU cannot see.

Regards
Ozzy

[Uncle George]

[QUOTE=SanDiegoSteve]First of all, be very cautious when using Uncle George as a rules or mechanics reference, because he is often wrong.

SanDiegoSteve, here's what I posted:

"It's the PU call to the bag, past the bag its the BU call. In this case, if ball hit's bag, PU has call."

No where did I say I was right! In this situation, the PU has the ball to the bag! In a two person crew, with the BU in the "C" position, the PU has the ball all the way down the line! Is the right or wrong?

You know Steve, when other umps read this forms, I hope they don't take the information word for word. For me, I go the rule book, case book and umpires manual to "get it right"!

After every game when I'm working with a seasoned ump, I ask for crituque, whether it's bad or good. You learn from your mistakes. If I do write something wrong, let me know but don't degrad me. You don't make mistakes? Belittling umps on this forms dosen't help ther confidence, it just tears it down. I apologize that I'm not as smart as you.

Uncle George

[LMan]

Originally Posted by DG

If there was a protest the PU would have to say "yes I saw it hit the bag, but..." to overule him. If he said "it didn't hit the bag, it hit a rock in foul territory just beyond the bag"...

I seriously doubt this guy would be smart enough to think of that one.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Uncle George

It's the PU call to the bag, past the bag it the BU calls. In this case, if ball it's [sic] bag, PU as [sic] call.

Uncle George,

I made the statement based on other posts of yours which provided incorrect, or downright bad advice. I just wanted the impressionable youths who frequent this forum to be careful when receiving advice from you. I'm also sure that they should do the same with advice from others here, myself included.

The quote above is what you said in post #2 of this thread. In post #1, the original play said that the BU was in position "C," which is located inside the diamond. This makes your statement that the BU has the call past the bag incorrect for the situation as described. The fact that the BU has the fair/foul past the base when working in "A" is irrelevant in this case, and should not have been presented in your post.

[mcrowder]

[QUOTE=Uncle George]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

First of all, be very cautious when using Uncle George as a rules or mechanics reference, because he is often wrong.

SanDiegoSteve, here's what I posted:

"It's the PU call to the bag, past the bag its the BU call. In this case, if ball hit's bag, PU has call."

No where did I say I was right! In this situation, the PU has the ball to the bag! In a two person crew, with the BU in the "C" position, the PU has the ball all the way down the line! Is the right or wrong?

You know Steve, when other umps read this forms, I hope they don't take the information word for word. For me, I go the rule book, case book and umpires manual to "get it right"!

After every game when I'm working with a seasoned ump, I ask for crituque, whether it's bad or good. You learn from your mistakes. If I do write something wrong, let me know but don't degrad me. You don't make mistakes? Belittling umps on this forms dosen't help ther confidence, it just tears it down. I apologize that I'm not as smart as you.

Uncle George

Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle. Nice try, but you really can't retract yourself out of this one. Pertaining to this actual thread and the first post, you were quite simply wrong. Just say, "Ooops, my bad" and move on. Trying to explain that in an alternate universe where the topic at hand was different, you might be right in an isolated case just makes you look foolish.

[TussAgee11]

The only time I'm ever turning Foul to Fair is when a) something so blatent has happened such as a rules mishap or b) if I have some sort of seizure and say foul ball on a pop up in foul territory before the ball hits the ground and a fielder catches it (which actually I think is i a FED casebook somewhere).

Regards, and thinking about living the dream of minor league ball after I graduate from college...

Tuss

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

Oh yeah! I'm always tryin to read anything on umpiring, that is when I can get a chance from school. Plate Work, Base Work, & Smart Baseball Umpiring how to get better every game, The Men In Blue & of course the orb, articles, & casebooks! More, more, & more!

Quality, not quantity, Littleboyblue. Read the rulebook and the appropriate mechanics book. Then read them again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

Then read them again.

[DonInKansas]

Originally Posted by GarthB

Quality, not quantity, Littleboyblue. Read the rulebook and the appropriate mechanics book. Then read them again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again.

Then read them again.

Dammit, I'm only on the 13th again.....

*Hustles towards rulebook to read it again*

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by DonInKansas

Dammit, I'm only on the 13th again.....

*Hustles towards rulebook to read it again*

I have copies of the OBR, PBUC blue and red handbooks, CCA Mechanics, NCAA Rulebook, FED Rulebook and Casebook in the family room, bathroom, bedroom, at school and in my equipment bag. Additionally, I keep a copy of the JEA in my family room. I don't stop re-reading them until August.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

JEA? Don't think I've ever heard of that.

At this point in your career, it's a nonessential. Read more of less.

[canadaump6]

I would like to get my hands on some good mechanics/positioning manuals. I've got "The Official Rules of Baseball", but that cost me an extra 40 bucks just to get it shipped to Canada (they do a great job at hiding this extra cost until you've already paid it). Sandiego Steve was nice enough to provide me with lots of rules interpretations, and I'm hoping to add to that with some mechanics and positioning manuals. Any suggestions?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by boyinblue24

Not sure what that means but yes sir!

What I am suggesting is that your posts to this point do not indicate you have the fundamental understanding of the rules and mechanics. Your time would be better spent improving that situation rather than on reading peripheral books.

[DG]

Originally Posted by canadaump6

I would like to get my hands on some good mechanics/positioning manuals. I've got "The Official Rules of Baseball", but that cost me an extra 40 bucks just to get it shipped to Canada (they do a great job at hiding this extra cost until you've already paid it). Sandiego Steve was nice enough to provide me with lots of rules interpretations, and I'm hoping to add to that with some mechanics and positioning manuals. Any suggestions?

You can read the rules for free at:

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info...s/foreword.jsp

Some good mechanics powerpoints here:

http://www.ihsa.org/education/index.htm