Definition of a fair ball

[SAump]

Originally Posted by nickrego

Unless someone posts some ruling, I have foul for all these situations, if the ball settles in foul territory.

If after hitting one of those objects, it is touched while in fair territory, I've got a fair ball.

So in other words, to me, those objects are the same as a pebble.

We also have to assume the equipment became detached accidentally.

Don't assume. The batter and fielder must accept responsibility for properly worn equipment. I have FAIR ball in all three situations, so play on Willie. Same as if the catcher chasing a PB/WP/throw stumbles and kicks it. He better get back up and PLAY. I really don't care how his glove/hat/helmet unintentionally came off. Coach JM hit the nail squarely on the head, "Absent any intent, if a fair batted ball hits it in fair territory, play on. If a batted ball hits it on or over foul territory while live, it's a foul ball."

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by SAump

Don't assume. The batter and fielder must accept responsibility for properly worn equipment. I have FAIR ball in all three situations, so play on Willie. Same as if the catcher chasing a PB/WP/throw stumbles and kicks it. He better get back up and PLAY. I really don't care how his glove/hat/helmet unintentionally came off. Coach JM hit the nail squarely on the head, "Absent any intent, if a fair batted ball hits it in fair territory, play on. If a batted ball hits it on or over foul territory while live, it's a foul ball."

I have FAIR ball in all three situations,

And you'd be wrong. "Play on" includes the possibility of the ball going foul - which it did, so it's foul.

[SAump]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

I have FAIR ball in all three situations,

And you'd be wrong. "Play on" includes the possibility of the ball going foul - which it did, so it's foul.

The ball has met all of MY established criteria for a FAIR batted BALL. There is nothing either batter or fielder can unintentionally do to remove that. I don't care if a gust of wind rolls the ball foul after contact w/ hat, glove or helmet. Now if it was done intentionally, then I would rule otherwise and stop Willie immediately.

[SAump]

Originally Posted by SAump

Coach JM hit the nail squarely on the head, "Absent any intent, if a fair batted ball hits it in fair territory, play on. If a batted ball hits it on or over foul territory while live, it's a foul ball."

Quote:
Since there is no FED rule or ruling/interpretation that contradicts these OBR rulings or suggests they would be treated differently in a FED-based game,

FED 2.5.1E The batter hits the ball, drops the bat and it unintentionally hits the ball a second time in ... (c) fair territory and is either touched by a fielder and/or comes to rest in foul territory. Ruling: In ...(c) the ball is fair.

Originally Posted by SAump

The ball has met all of MY established criteria for a FAIR batted BALL. There is nothing either batter or fielder can unintentionally do to remove that. I don't care if a gust of wind rolls the ball foul after contact w/ hat, glove or helmet. Now if it was done intentionally, then I would rule otherwise and stop Willie immediately.

I'm not sure if its a context issue or a multiple redundancy issue? I added Bob's explanation as it is the closest one to being FAIR. It's one thing to write about a fair batted ball or a batted ball over fair territory as Bob has correctly pointed out. It's another to write about a fair batted ball in fair territory. Also that damn helmet/pebble analogy is tougher to understand than the helmet/bat anaolgy I expected (post 11 above) to find.

I had no intention of bringing up the same subject for another round of discussion. I was merely trying to point out why post 45 was necessary. I would like to thank Bob J again for pointing that out somehwere back around post 50. I can't understand how Bob understands me and why I still need a translator to get a point across. Did I miss something there GMBoy (not BOB)? Oh, PFISTO is a post deleter.

Originally Posted by SAump

D has been discussed, first by CoachJM in post number 7, and I have already stated my opinion of the ruling. Perhaps, CoachJM will be kind enuf to expalin why he rules foul in all 3 situations covered in post #2. I defer the balance of my time here to others.

I should of stopped at 18, but getting here was more fun. I told you that a long time ago.

[Rich Ives]

SAump:

If a batter removes his helmet and tries to hit a pitch, and misses, is it a strike?

2.00 A STRIKE is a legal pitch when so called by the umpire, which --
(a) Is struck at by the batter and is missed;

Doesn't say "struck at with his bat" after all.

[SAump]

Originally Posted by SAump

Don't assume. The batter and fielder must accept responsibility for properly worn equipment. I have FAIR ball in all three situations, so play on Willie. Same as if the catcher chasing a PB/WP/throw stumbles and kicks it. He better get back up and PLAY. I really don't care how his glove/hat/helmet unintentionally came off. Coach JM hit the nail squarely on the head, "Absent any intent, if a fair batted ball hits it in fair territory, play on. If a batted ball hits it on or over foul territory while live, it's a foul ball."

Coach JM was right in post #2. I had not paid much attention to it. Then he changed the ruling in post #7 and was right again. I had hung my hat on it. Coach JM later corrected his error in post #45 and was still right again. I kept asking for CoachJM to explain why he would first call one play foul, then fair, and then foul again. I wanted to know the difference between post 2, 7 and 45; or if anyone could help me understand what was going on. That "hat" I was relying on accidently fell off my head and hit the turf when I stumbled.

My entire argument rested on the fact that I had initially read "a fair batted ball hits it" in post #7. I got distracted and couldn't see why a fair ball could be foul. I now see he meant to say a batted ball all along and was unaware of his own mistake. I was also unaware of the difference until the rug was pulled out from under me. So much for the grand canal theory. But Coach, I would never ever change a foul call to fair. That was ugly.