Illegally batted ball... am I the only one...

[Leecedar]

who makes this call? It's simple... in all places except little league, the batter is out if he makes contact with the ball while his foot is either on home plate or completely out of the batter's box. Yet, NOBODY seems to know this, and I can only recall one person besides me who's called it. (By the way, in little league, if the kid's foot is on the plate but a portion of his foot is still in the box, it's legal.)

I had a college game where the batter squared around with his foot touching the black (I know the black isn't part of the plate) but his foot isn't 6" wide unless he's sasquatch. So I made the call, and the coach went berzerk, and my evaluator said I might have been over-umpiring; he said he'd probably have let that one go. Yesterday, I'm doing a men's league game, and the guy chases an outside pitch so that almost his entire foot is in front of the plate (maybe 1" of heel was still toward the batter's box) and I made the call. The coach came out, told me he had NEVER had that called against him, etc... etc... etc...

Just curious... am I the only guy unfortunate enough to have it happen in his games, or are most umpires just not taking a glance at the feet?

Lee

[UMP25]

There was a heated discussion on this several months ago, and the consensus seemed to be that no one called it, with the most common reason being that plate umpires were too busy watching other things back there that they couldn't really see an illegally batted ball. Some expressed surprise when I stated that I have seen it and have called it. I don't recall if I ever explained that the ONLY time I've ever called this is during a bunt attempt, when it's far easier to call it.

I'm not talking about the simple squaring around to bunt. I've called it when the batter squares to bunt and does one of those running bunts where he ends up contacting the ball while he's halfway into the infield. If a plate umpire cannot see and call that, then there's something wrong.

Out of 150-180 games per year, I get this probably once, MAYBE twice, and each time it generates a discussion from the head coach/manager. He asks, I answer, and the game continues. I probably should note that I give the benefit of the doubt to the batter, and if the batter's box lines aren't visible, it really has to be obvious for me to call it.

[Leecedar]

Originally Posted by UMP25

There was a heated discussion on this several months ago, and the consensus seemed to be that no one called it, with the most common reason being that plate umpires were too busy watching other things back there that they couldn't really see an illegally batted ball. Some expressed surprise when I stated that I have seen it and have called it. I don't recall if I ever explained that the ONLY time I've ever called this is during a bunt attempt, when it's far easier to call it.

I'm not talking about the simple squaring around to bunt. I've called it when the batter squares to bunt and does one of those running bunts where he ends up contacting the ball while he's halfway into the infield. If a plate umpire cannot see and call that, then there's something wrong.

Out of 150-180 games per year, I get this probably once, MAYBE twice, and each time it generates a discussion from the head coach/manager. He asks, I answer, and the game continues. I probably should note that I give the benefit of the doubt to the batter, and if the batter's box lines aren't visible, it really has to be obvious for me to call it.

Maybe it's because I also do softball and the slap hitters do it far more, but I get the situation about once every couple of months. It's usually easy, with the foot being on the plate. I just don't understand why we're not looking for it when the guy (or gal) squares, starts right at the edge of the box or makes a really awkward swing.

Lee

[tibear]

I call this probably two or three times a year and as UMP25 says usually when the batter is trying to bunt.

It makes for an interesting discussion sometimes when the batter is called out on a foul ball during an attempted bunt.

The conversation usually goes something like:

Umpire: "Batter out for contacting ball while out of the batter's box!"

Coach: "But that was only strike one??"

Umpire: "Doesn't matter, he was outside the batter's box when he hit the ball. He's out."

Coach: "I've never heard of that rule."

Umpire: "Check the rule book. We can talk after the game if you like but not during the game."

The game then continues and either the coach comes out during the game and says I'm right or I never hear from them again about it.

[LilLeaguer]

Originally Posted by Leecedar

who makes this call? It's simple... in all places except little league, the batter is out if he makes contact with the ball while his foot is either on home plate or completely out of the batter's box. Yet, NOBODY seems to know this, and I can only recall one person besides me who's called it. (By the way, in little league, if the kid's foot is on the plate but a portion of his foot is still in the box, it's legal.)

I had a college game where the batter squared around with his foot touching the black (I know the black isn't part of the plate) but his foot isn't 6" wide unless he's sasquatch. So I made the call, and the coach went berzerk, and my evaluator said I might have been over-umpiring; he said he'd probably have let that one go. Yesterday, I'm doing a men's league game, and the guy chases an outside pitch so that almost his entire foot is in front of the plate (maybe 1" of heel was still toward the batter's box) and I made the call. The coach came out, told me he had NEVER had that called against him, etc... etc... etc...

Just curious... am I the only guy unfortunate enough to have it happen in his games, or are most umpires just not taking a glance at the feet?

Lee

To answer your question, I can't recall making this call, but if I did, it was in a Little League game.

I don't think that this was your only mis-characterization of the rule. LL follows OBR in that the plate is not mentioned in Rule 6.06. I'm not an expert, but I believe that NCAA follows OBR as well, leaving FED as the oddball ruleset to mention home plate.

I don't know what '1" of heel was still toward the batter's box' means, but if it means that 1" of heel was over the line marking the box, my understanding is that rule 6.06 does not apply. One foot has to be on the ground entirely out of the box.

The previous thread is very interesting reading.

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by Leecedar

who makes this call? It's simple... in all places except little league, the batter is out if he makes contact with the ball while his foot is either on home plate or completely out of the batter's box. Yet, NOBODY seems to know this, and I can only recall one person besides me who's called it. (By the way, in little league, if the kid's foot is on the plate but a portion of his foot is still in the box, it's legal.)

I had a college game where the batter squared around with his foot touching the black (I know the black isn't part of the plate) but his foot isn't 6" wide unless he's sasquatch. So I made the call, and the coach went berzerk, and my evaluator said I might have been over-umpiring; he said he'd probably have let that one go. Yesterday, I'm doing a men's league game, and the guy chases an outside pitch so that almost his entire foot is in front of the plate (maybe 1" of heel was still toward the batter's box) and I made the call. The coach came out, told me he had NEVER had that called against him, etc... etc... etc...

Just curious... am I the only guy unfortunate enough to have it happen in his games, or are most umpires just not taking a glance at the feet?

Lee

nobody knows this because it isn't a rule.

[Delaware Blue]

Originally Posted by Leecedar

(By the way, in little league, if the kid's foot is on the plate but a portion of his foot is still in the box, it's legal.)

That's legal in any game played under OBR. It's not legal in games played under FED rules (and I think NCAA).

[bossman72]

I'm only going to call this if it's pretty obvious since i'm watching the pitch as priority #1. If he is barely touching the black of the plate, i'm not going to call it. If he's totally in front of it as in your second example, i would call it (if i happen to see it).

[tibear]

Originally Posted by bobbybanaduck

nobody knows this because it isn't a rule.

6.06
A batter is out for illegal action when --
(a) He hits a ball with one or both feet on the ground entirely outside the batter’s box.

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by Delaware Blue

That's legal in any game played under OBR (and I think NCAA). It's not legal in games played under FED rules.

It's legal only under OBR. Under NCAA, touching the plate while contacting the ball is, like FED, a no-no.

[bobbybanaduck]

Originally Posted by tibear

6.06
A batter is out for illegal action when --
(a) He hits a ball with one or both feet on the ground entirely outside the batter’s box.

thanks for the update. i know the rule. the original post stated that the batter was out when he was stepping on the plate, except in LL, which is wrong.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by tibear

6.06
A batter is out for illegal action when --
(a) He hits a ball with one or both feet on the ground entirely outside the batter’s box.

Note the lack of a mention of home plate in that rule. Thanks for proving Bobby's point.

[tibear]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

Note the lack of a mention of home plate in that rule. Thanks for proving Bobby's point.

Am I missing something or do you guys think home plate is actually inside the batter's box???

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by tibear

Am I missing something or do you guys think home plate is actually inside the batter's box???

No, but they know that one can have a foot touching home plate and still be in the batter's box. (OBR)

[tibear]

If the batter's back foot is completely on the plate and you claim that "you're tracking the pitch" and not looking on the plate to see the foot. Perhaps you shouldn't be behind the plate. The batter's body is blocking most of the strike zone and you wouldn't notice?????