Batter out of box

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Tim C

Rich's answer suffices for my view.

A "better" example for you to ask would have been:

Right handed hitter, and the hit-and-run play is on. F1 pitches out so that the ball is in the left handed batter's box - - -

Batter reaches Waaay across and pokes the ball into right field.

What would you call?

Again, when tracking a pitch I would have no idea if the batter's foot was actually on the ground outside the batter's box -- I do not call what I do not see therefore I would ignore it.

38 years, 3801 games and I have never considered calling this "violation."

Regards,

I didn't want to know about a hit-and-run play that the batter "reaches" for. I wouldn't see his footwork on this play either, nor would anyone else quite frankly. Nor would I care.

I asked specifically about a batter who doesn't know how to bunt properly, who squares around and his back foot is entirely on top of the plate, which is clearly visible in the umpire's peripheral vision. If you saw this, would you call it?

[RonRef]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I didn't want to know about a hit-and-run play that the batter "reaches" for. I wouldn't see his footwork on this play either, nor would anyone else quite frankly. Nor would I care.

I asked specifically about a batter who doesn't know how to bunt properly, who squares around and his back foot is entirely on top of the plate, which is clearly visible in the umpire's peripheral vision. If you saw this, would you call it?

I agree with Steve, the couple of times I have called it was on bunts plays like he described. Why would you have to keep tracking a pitch that you know is about 2-3 feet outside? We need to call this infraction "if" we see it. It bothers me when I read that guys will flat out ignore it even if they see it. We won't catch them all that is for sure, but if it is obvious we need to get it! You say you can't do two things at the same instance, then how do you track the pitch and see if the batter checked his swing or if he offered at a bunt?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RonRef

I agree with Steve, the couple of times I have called it was on bunts plays like he described. Why would you have to keep tracking a pitch that you know is about 2-3 feet outside? We need to call this infraction "if" we see it. It bothers me when I read that guys will flat out ignore it even if they see it. We won't catch them all that is for sure, but if it is obvious we need to get it! You say you can't do two things at the same instance, then how do you track the pitch and see if the batter checked his swing or if he offered at a bunt?

Because those things usually happen in my frame of vision as I'm tracking the pitch. But I will get blocked out from time to time even then and that's why we have the check swing appeal.

Philosophically speaking: I just don't see why a foot out of the box on a bunt (usually a sac bunt on a bad pitch) is something we should be jumping all over. The offense is giving away an out in the first place. Let them do it. But then again, I'm not seeing it. I don't look down at the feet when I'm working the plate.

[UmpJM]

Rich,

You pretty much anticipated what was "bothering me" - thanks for clarifying.

I think I'm beginning to see the light.

For Bob J.,

This is what JEA says:

Customs and Usage: Umpires should be especially attentive when an intentional walk is being given, a batter is
bunting for a base hit, or a pitch-out is being thrown. These are the times a batter is most likely to step out of the
box to hit the ball.

JM

[Tim C]

We have another subject that will separate umpires forever.

Add this to:

Does there need to be voluntary release of a gloved ball?

Can a fast ball really "rise"?

Can a pitch be called a strike that bounces before F2 catches it?

Entertainment value only . . .

Regards,

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Tim C

Can a fast ball really "rise"?

Certainly, and it's been scientifically proven!

A pitcher applying vaseline or other similar substances will cause the ball to drop precipitively at about the 59' foot mark.

Similarly, a pitcher applying Viagra or other similar substances will cause the ball to rise. It's basic chemistry.

It's true, it's true.....

[Tim C]

JR:

I do not believe I have ever used a "smiley face" before . . .

POTW,

Regards,

[RonRef]

Originally Posted by Tim C

JR:

I do not believe I have ever used a "smiley face" before . . .

POTW,

Regards,

Tim, maybe you should smile more?

[Tim C]

"It is not about finding or looking for problems, it is about enforcing the rules of the game."

And therein Ron lies part of the problem.

Baseball, more than other sports, is heavily influenced by not only "common sense and fair play" but by what Evans calls "common usage and tradition."

We call a game with established rules (I consider them "guidelines") that have been influenced by not only decades of play situations but defined information from several sources that impact individual rules codes (i.e. before the recent OBR release there were 237 common erros in the OBR, slowly they are being corrected).

I am not going to sit here and call people names or get over emotional about any baseball rule, "guideline" or play.

I have given my honest and unadulterated opinion about this "mechanic" (not the rule, note we are talking about physical abilities) and the fact will always remain that I have not called this violation nor can I picture a time that I would.

For me (again, my opinion) is that umpiring is not done for "fun" -- it is a serious commitment and a constant effort to umpire a perfect game.

Sorry we can never agree on the play in question . . . but I do ask that you understand that some people review umpiring is a slightly different light than you.

I can understand your position -- can you understand, or respect mine?

Regards,

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by RonRef

It bothers me when I read that guys will flat out ignore it even if they see it.

Nobody has said they will ignore it if they see it. They have said they are very sure they won't see it, because they are doing something far more important - calling the pitch.