Verbal Obstruction ?

[UmpJM]

johnnyg08,

That is correct, the concept of "verbal obstruction" is completely absent from OBR, while it is explicitly present in the FED rules.

Some experienced umpires have suggested to me that, in "lower level" games that use OBR as the foundation ruleset, it might make sense to apply the concept (especially if it is the opposing coach who is verbally obstructing the kid runner) in such games. Personally, I think they've got a point and I believe 9.01(c) would apply.

Visual obstruction, on the other hand, is pertinent to both rulesets.

JM

[johnnyg08]

coach, since it's not present in OBR, then it's legal in an OBR game? example: F4 is holding R2 on with V-cuts, slapping his glove and yelling "back." Yelling "back"/"foul ball"/etc...are legal in and OBR game? I know this post is rather redundant, but I work several one man games over the summer and I need to be 100% sure of these types of things before I enforce them. I couldn't find anything in OBR and you are backing me up here, so it's fair to assume that this type of thing is legal...though in some leagues, considered "bush"? Thanks fellas. Been umpring 8 years, though still a steep learning curve...these messsage boards are great!

[mcrowder]

Legal. Bush... but legal.

[Bainer]

Originally Posted by LMan

Hooray for you. Regardless of whether you ever heard of FED before, you asked what association or level had verbal interference, I answered your question (as did CJM, in much better detail). The OP said, "high school rules", which explicitly implies FED.

The term 'High School rules" does NOT explicitly imply FED- it implies FED if you are in the USA (not including apparently Rhode Island or Massachusetts- so even less explicit!). The original post does not indicate which State or even Country the situation occurred in. Our high school league follows OBA (Ontario Baseball Association) rules, also WECSSAA, SWOSSAA and OFSSAA guidelines- not FED.

My reply was based on OBR, which as a number here have posted, allow this behavior- and as they and I wrote previously- bush, but legal.

I'm not new here, and I'm not closed minded- thanks to those that suggested both. A question was asked, and I offered an answer based on the info provided- period. That's what the site is for...


Bainer.

[mcrowder]

Well if you're not new here, then how in the world could you have never heard of FED rules? I didn't feel I was being condescending by saying you were probably new ... I was basing this opinion on your own statements. I'm completely flummoxed that you could spend more than a week here and not come across the fact that a majority of the posts involve a discussion of FED rules.

I've never heard of NFHS or FED in my life"

Assuming your life includes your recent time on this board, how is this possible?!?!?!

[SanDiegoSteve]

Bainer,

I'm finding it hard to believe you have "never heard of FED" if you have been paying attention at all in the 3 years you have been on this site.

99.9% of high school baseball is played under FED rules in this country (only two of the tiniest states do not use FED rules), so the natural assumption, as dangerous as assuming can be, is that he meant FED rules when he said high school rules. You immediately chimed in with "not under high school rules," without stopping to consider that the majority of HS ball is played by FED rules.

[Bainer]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

Assuming your life includes your recent time on this board, how is this possible?!?!?!

It is possible because I don't get involved with league-specific debates.
If a question is about softball, I have no idea about the rules- so I know I can't assist, and I stay out of it. Same with little league, pony, legion, Babe Ruth, and all of the other leagues that I have no experience with or knowledge of- including FED.
This post, however, did not mention a league.

Whether or not the Forum is predominantly 'FED', it is not a 'FED Forum'. As has been illustrated in this thread- the rules can and do differ.


Bainer.

[mcrowder]

Nice deflection - doesn't answer the question. How is it possible for you to spend more than a week on this board (much less 3 years), and be able to truthfully say, "I've never heard of FED rules". You may avoid answering those questions, but in the process of avoiding them, surely you've HEARD of them.

And surely you can see why since the majority of the Baseball-Playing, English-Speaking world has high schools playing under FED rules, it is at least a BIT odd that you would make the assumption that (as posted in the OP) the phrase, "High-School Rules" would mean Canadian high school alphabet soup rules. You don't find that at least a LITTLE bizarre? (If you don't, then the OTHER guy was right, and you're amazingly closeminded - I'll give you the benefit of doubt here until you remove it).

And I didn't say the board was FED centric. We deal with LL, OBR, Legion, and all sorts of other organizations ... I was saying that 75% of the threads touch on FED rules in their responses (even if the original question was OBR). I'd also say that 75% of the threads touch on OBR rules too. It's the minority that manages to focus solely on one ruleset.

[Bainer]

Dude-
He asked what's the call?, not what's the FED ruling.
I don't know FED because I don't do FED- I don't need to know FED.
I haven't heard of FED because I don't read through every thread on the forum. I scan the posts for something I can help with, or something I need help with.
Question was asked- question was answered.
If you choose to continue a personal attack, go ahead- maybe FED rules allow that too- but I'm done with this thread.

Thanks to all those who cleared up the FED/OBR differences.


Bainer.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Dave Hensley

Then you are apparently in one of the two states in the country that do not use NFHS rules (Rhode Island is one; I forget the other.)

Welcome to the internet, where you'll find other examples that there's a whole 'nother world out there beyond your livingroom.

Four states, because Montana doesn't play high school baseball at all and it appears Wyoming doesn't either.

[Peruvian]

It is legal, (although discouraged here in my state) for the fielder to yell "Back! Back!". The only time it is enforced as verbal obstruction, is when the verbage causes the runner to go back into the base, like it did in the earlier case play..

[umpduck11]

Originally Posted by Peruvian

It is legal, (although discouraged here in my state) for the fielder to yell "Back! Back!". The only time it is enforced as verbal obstruction, is when the verbage causes the runner to go back into the base, like it did in the earlier case play..

Peruvian,
At the state camp this weekend, this very subject was discussed. The
directors and instructors were adamant that this is to be inforced. I found
it ironic that this discussion came up, after we dealt with it over the weekend.

[DG]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

Four states, because Montana doesn't play high school baseball at all and it appears Wyoming doesn't either.

It seems un-American not to play baseball. What do young people do in Montana and Wyoming, rodeo?

[LMan]

Originally Posted by Bainer

but I'm done with this thread.

Best idea you've had.

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by Bainer

The term 'High School rules" does NOT explicitly imply FED- it implies FED if you are in the USA (not including apparently Rhode Island or Massachusetts- so even less explicit!).

it pretty much does though. ive never once in the 4 or so years ive been reading this site read a single post about a high school game played under anything but FED.

The original post does not indicate which State or even Country the situation occurred in. Our high school league follows OBA (Ontario Baseball Association) rules, also WECSSAA, SWOSSAA and OFSSAA guidelines- not FED.

O RLY?