In the dirt or not?

[mbyron]

Originally posted by Carl Childress
The Yankess play in the largest media market in the United States. They drew over four million fans this year. They are in the business to make money, and winning teams make money because they bring in more paying customers and have higher TV ratings. If the team wins a championshihp, they make even more money.

It's just plain ignorant to hate the Yankees because they spend money to improve their chances of winning. Suppose the Colorado Rockies had the resources of the Yankees. Don't you think they would spend some of it to put together a better team?

There's nothing wrong with hating the Yankees. But pick a logical reason, like: They almost always beat my team.

This apology for Steinbrenner presupposes that he runs his club in a vacuum, and that his operations have no pernicious effects on baseball.

Both of those claims are false.

[David B]

Originally posted by Steve Emerson
Next time you see this look at the batter who is the White Sox catcher, he did look back and he say the PU motion and HE knew what it meant, because he had already had to tag a batter on a swinging stike skipper. Don't you think it's kind of ironic that one catcher knew the umpires mechanics and one didn't. Eddings said he would do it different next time, but his mechanics were the same from the start of the game to the end. Also it should be a clue to the catcher that when you do not hear the umpire say "OUT" you better do something besides roll the ball to the mound.

The difference between a good catcher, and a substitute catcher.

Just because you make it to the "bigs" don't mean that you know exactly how to play the game.

On another note, baseball continues to water down their talent and its going to be even more evident with the "steriod" testing.

Why can Roger Clemens continue to be the best pitcher in baseball at 43? years of age. Sure, in the mold of Nolan Ryan he has great mechanics and work ethic and he's not afraid to pitch inside, but the other side is that you don't have to pitch but to three or four batters per team - the rest are batting .250 and are overmatched.

Randy Johnson was supposed to be the Savior for the Yankees since Clemens had left, but as they learned, he's not the same pitcher he was three/ four years ago, but he's still one of the better pitchers in the game.

That said, its still fun to watch, but I wonder what my boy will be saying about baseball 10 years from now????

Thanks
David

[JJ]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RPatrino "...if the batter swings, and the strike is caught, I combine my "sideways point" (eyes looking forward, of course)with a mild "out" hammer. I do not verbalize strike three. Now,if the players act confused,they don't realize the ball was caught, and they start to act "hinky" I will verbalize, "batter is out".
If the third strike is not caught, then I just do my "sideways point" (eyes looking forward, of course), with no mild "out" hammer."


On the head - this is what I've done for years, and I've never had a problem. This mechanic removes doubt from everyone's mind. If there's doubt in MY mind if the ball was caught or trapped, I will already have discussed this possibility in a pregame with my partner(s), and will have made eye contact with him (them), and based on what indication signal we have agreed on I will make my call. Do I still catch heck now and then? Yep. Love this game!

JJ

[Edited by JJ on Oct 14th, 2005 at 09:58 AM]

[Carl Childress]

Originally posted by mbyron

This apology for Steinbrenner presupposes that he runs his club in a vacuum, and that his operations have no pernicious effects on baseball.

Both of those claims are false.

Doc:

A better plumber in my town has a pernicisou effect on all the other plumbers.

It's amazing how "communists" come out of the woodwork when someone begins using "capitalism" as it was intended.

It's a business, for crying out loud. They've already got profit sharing. All that nonsense is an attempt to keep losing franchises in business.

What's wrong with market corrections? If the Twins can't cut the mustard....

Don't use the mores of amateur sports in the same breath with the professional game.

Everybody seems upset that player salaries are sky high. The American way is for the worker to get what he can. If somebody wants to pay six million a year for a guy who bats .245, more powser to him.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by DG
Clearly a catch, no change of direction, but the PU does not have replays at his disposal. But he clearly gave an OUT signal. And the whole crew pooched this one as well.

Not true. Fox showed it again last night, when Jeanne Zelasko did a short promo on ACLS Game 3. The replay shows the ball changing directio, just as a ball does when it's trapped. Perhaps you haven't seen that replay but don't tell me what I've seen and haven't seen.

[Rich]

Originally posted by Carl Childress

Two points:

(1) Unless you're psychic, how can you know that the Yankees would always be second division with a salary cap?

(2) I lived in New York City in 1957, when you could get into the grandstands for 75 cents. I imagine I've seen more Yankee games than you have seen major league baseball.

One thing I know: There are always poor souls around, like you, who can't stand that someone else wins.

Concerning your knock of the Cowboys: You live in Wisconsin. Super Bowls: Green Bay won the first two - but nothing since. Minnesota (near you) lost four. Tennessee never won. Seattle never went. Pittsburg won four, the last one in 1980. Oh, the last time they went, they lost to - gasp - Dallas.

Dallas won five (tied for most): 72, 78, 93, 94, 96.

Do you dislike Dallas because:

(a) they win and your teams don't?
(b) they're in Texas?
(c) they're the world's favorite football team (based on sales of NFL products)?
(d) all of the above?

I've only found one article talking about team sales, and it suggests the Raiders are #1, which is equally ludicrous:

http://www.bizjournals.com/sanfranci...10/story2.html

Dallas hasn't won a playoff game in 10 seasons. But most of the people who follow "America's Team" are people who latched on in the 1970s or the 1990s when the Cowboys were winning. I've talked to Cowboys fans who have never been to Texas, have never been to a game, etc. I HATE fair-weather, band-wagon fans. It's easy to be a fan when the team wins.

You lived in New York (which I didn't know), so enjoy your Yankees. It has nothing to do with Texas, Carl -- I am rooting for the Astros to win it all.

And I live in Wisconsin, but I've been an Eagles fan since I've been walking. I grew up in PA. I could send you a cheesehead, though, if you are interested.

--Rich

[UMP25]

Originally posted by Carl Childress
Pittsburg won four, the last one in 1980. Oh, the last time they went, they lost to - gasp - Dallas.

Dallas won five (tied for most): 72, 78, 93, 94, 96.

As a lifelong Steelers fan, Carl, I'm trying to figure out if I should be insulted by this comment.

[tmp44]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

That's idiotic.

Rich,

I don't disagree with you. But in all sports around here, if you don't use strict NFHS mechanics, then you will be lucky to get a post-season assignment. If you are lucky enough to get one, then you better know your evaluator really well to move on to another round. Here it's the hammer for both strike and out, as per the signal chart on pg. 70.

[greymule]

If somebody wants to pay six million a year for a guy who bats .245, more power to him.

Absolutely right. People who complain about the money ballplayers make act as if someone is putting a gun to the owners' heads. Apparently these people prefer that the ultra-rich owners keep more of their money.

If I want to pay somebody $200 to mow my half-acre lawn, that's up to me. If someone wants to mow my lawn for $5, that's up to him.

I've heard people argue that the government should dictate what jobs pay. (I live in a university town.) All pay--of truck drivers, secretaries, painters, probably umpires, too--should be determined by "experts" (like them) at universities. "Comparable worth" is their euphemism for this kind of Stalinism. The free market, you see, results in inequity.

One guy even claims that everyone should make the same. "Garbage collectors need the money just as much as surgeons," says this Ivy Leaguer. And to make up for the fact that some people inherit money and others don't, no one should be allowed to inherit money. Instead, in the new Utopia, everyone will get $80,000 from the government at age 21 or so, to get started in adulthood. Yes, I'm serious.

In New Jersey, public schools must pay baseball umpires and softball umpires the same. Gender equity. So an ump has a choice: $74 for an 80-minute softball game where arguments are rare and the fans are polite, or $74 for a 160-minute baseball game where. . . . Well, guess which sport is overflowing with officials and which sport needs them.

[Edited by greymule on Oct 14th, 2005 at 11:46 AM]

[Rich]

Originally posted by tmp44

Rich,

I don't disagree with you. But in all sports around here, if you don't use strict NFHS mechanics, then you will be lucky to get a post-season assignment. If you are lucky enough to get one, then you better know your evaluator really well to move on to another round. Here it's the hammer for both strike and out, as per the signal chart on pg. 70.

I wouldn't know what HS mechanics are. I throw the manual out as soon as it arrives in the mail. Who covers a bases empty triple in PA?

[LDUB]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser
I wouldn't know what HS mechanics are. I throw the manual out as soon as it arrives in the mail. Who covers a bases empty triple in PA?

The signals are shown in the rule book.

[Rich]

Originally posted by LDUB

The signals are shown in the rule book.

Luke,

Why would a baseball umpire need a picture to tell him "how to signal." What do I look like, an ASA girls softball robot?

--Rich

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

Luke,

Why would a baseball umpire need a picture to tell him "how to signal." What do I look like, an ASA girls softball robot?

--Rich

That is the same thing I was thinking. In my association, we have pointers, and we have hammerers. We don't let the Fed dictate to us what a strike call is supposed to look like. We celebrate individual style, as long as it stays within accepted mechanics. No robots here. I point on called strikes, use a nonchalant hammer for swinging strikes, and on strike three not caught, I point twice in the manner of selling a foul call, in one quick, emphatic motion. I have yet to have anybody be confused by it.

[Bandit]

Originally posted by Rich Fronheiser

Luke,

Why would a baseball umpire need a picture to tell him "how to signal." What do I look like, an ASA girls softball robot?

--Rich

Have read a lot of posts on this subject since the game, have listened to a lot of talk radio, and seen a BUNCH of ESPN experts give their thoughts on this event. Rich, one thing seems clear....if baseball would maybe become more like the ASA girls softball robots as you have called us, this problem might not have even occured and a CLEAR and COMMON mechanic might have been used and dictated the play and it's results. It's funny how baseball seems to be going more and more to the slot position behind the plate even in the majors, isn't that a "softball" mechanic? Hmmmmmmmm ? Maybe us robots do know something!

[gordon30307]

Originally posted by Bandit

Have read a lot of posts on this subject since the game, have listened to a lot of talk radio, and seen a BUNCH of ESPN experts give their thoughts on this event. Rich, one thing seems clear....if baseball would maybe become more like the ASA girls softball robots as you have called us, this problem might not have even occured and a CLEAR and COMMON mechanic might have been used and dictated the play and it's results. It's funny how baseball seems to be going more and more to the slot position behind the plate even in the majors, isn't that a "softball" mechanic? Hmmmmmmmm ? Maybe us robots do know something!

Softball. Bandit is an appropriate handle for a softball umpire. I hear that they hand out "new masks and guns" each time you guys pass the fed. test!!!!!!!!!!!!! With 60 foot fields I don't understand why you need two guys to officiate the game. Unless your collecting social security you're too young to do softball!!!!!!!!! LOL