Question about Intense D

[potato]

It's pretty normal for body contacts between a defender and an offense especially when it's near the paint, happens almost 90% of the time when the offense is back to basket and pressing the defender backwards. The defender would often use his body (usually chest) to prevent the offense from advancing by contacting his shoulder/back .

However would the same defensive measure be allowed if it's far from the paint, say 3 point line on a ball handler or backcourt during full court pressure? The defender would stay really close to the ball handler, using his chest to have contact with the ball handler while the handler is facing sideways/backwards against the defender to protect the ball.

Also would the same technique be allowed, to pressure a ball handler out of bounds when the handler is very close to the lines?

Seems like borderline between illegal contact & pushing yet it's seems like a common D.

[#olderthanilook]

When I'm officiating, I'm not necessarily trying to distinguish which body parts can and can't be used in certain ways. Butts, arms, legs...most players have all of those parts. (Reminds me of the old fast food commercial "Parts are parts!") The key is - was an offensive player re-directed, slowed down or displaced because of any type of contact (by any body part) by the defender? If yes, then I probably have some sort of illegal contact - push, hand check or block.

Conversley, if I judge the offensive player to be displacing a defender, it's a player or team control foul.

[bob jenkins]

the rules (well, the rules applicable here) don't change based on the location on the court.

if the defense has legal guarding position, they can't be displaced. If they don't, they can't affect the dribbler's path.

"pressuring" the ball handler out of bounds implies (to me) a movement by the defender toward the dribbler, and so would be illegal. But, if there's no sufficient room between the defenseive player and the boundary, then the onus is on the offensive player.

[fortmoney]

RSBQ

3 types of contact:
1) incidental
2) marginal
3) illegal

All fouls involve contact but not all contact is a foul

[MD Longhorn]

No offense intended here, but from this question and 2 other ones, it seems to me that you're approaching officiating from a backward point of view. You're going to be a lot better off learning what is and is not allowed, and your definitions, rather than trying to disect how long half a step is, and worrying about which body parts can do what. Both defenders and offensive players have things they can do and things they can't. Learn those and you'll be FAR better off, and won't have questions like these.

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

No offense intended here, but from this question and 2 other ones, it seems to me that you're approaching officiating from a backward point of view. You're going to be a lot better off learning what is and is not allowed, and your definitions, rather than trying to disect how long half a step is, and worrying about which body parts can do what. Both defenders and offensive players have things they can do and things they can't. Learn those and you'll be FAR better off, and won't have questions like these.

The problem, as I see it based on my very limited reading of these potato threads, is that he is not seeking information or approaching these questions from an officiating standpoint at all.

He is approaching from a pick up player/fan standpoint and doesn't seem to get it.

[potato]

well in most of the NBA games you see the big guys back to basket, slowly using his back to backoff the defender backwards in order to get to the basket, while most of the time the defender has to use his upper body to prevent the big man from getting closer, why would this be allowed, won't it be called an offensive foul for displacing the defender?

and if it's a defender pressuring a ball handler, can they get so close that the chest is in contact with the handler's body, it may not displace the handler but severly obstruct the handler's movement, or simply make the handler loose his balance. i'm asking because i'm annoyed when a guy starts closing in on 3 point line and presses his body on me, of course i can easily get away but when he 1st does it it's annoying.

[Judtech]

I preferred Heavy D

[Adam]

The whole idea of defense is to legally obstruct the dribbler's path.

[MD Longhorn]

Trying to find my Streetball Rulebook so I can look up where to send change requests to, then I can send in a rule change to prevent the offensive player from being annoying.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by potato

well in most of the NBA games you see the big guys back to basket, slowly using his back to backoff the defender backwards in order to get to the basket, while most of the time the defender has to use his upper body to prevent the big man from getting closer, why would this be allowed, won't it be called an offensive foul for displacing the defender?

Under NFHS and NCAA rules this could be an offensive foul. But sometimes it's really just the defender giving way slowly and not being displaced by the offense.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

But sometimes it's really just the defender giving way slowly and not being displaced by the offense.

Great point. In our high school games, if the defender would just stop, and hold his spot, then any displacement of the defensive player would be a foul on the offensive player.