Always learning

[Andy]

Bob - First of all, I'm going to comment on part of your post besides the actions of the coach.

You mentioned some chirping by coaches at the line judges. If IN is like AZ, most of the line judges in our HS matches are HS students from the home team. If this is the case, I have ZERO tolerarance for chirping at the LJs. I deal with this swiftly and decisively. Usually, LJs are not trained officials and I need them to be focused on their duties, not worried about some mouthy coach or other bench personnel.

As for the coach in the substitution zone instructing his players:

First time, a step over the line, I would notice, but probably ignore as you did, thinking that he just wasn't really aware of his position. Next time, he's two steps into the zone and you chose to warn him - I'm OK with that as long as the match is going smoothly and he is cooperative.

Once you have issued the warning, however, you need to be prepared to take the next step if he violates again. Now you know the penalty, a YC. A YC in volleyball is nothing more than a formal warning. In effect, you are telling the coach that "I gave you an informal warning that you were in violation, you have chosen to violate again, now you get a formal warning. If you violate again, it's a Red Card and loss of rally."

If I remember correctly, you officiate other sports besides volleyball. It's pretty much the same across the board, if you chose to warn someone about something, be prepared to back it up with a formal sanction (whatever that may be in the sport being played) if it happens again. Anything less sends the message that you as an official are not willing to take care of business.

[MCBear]

Andy, you bring up a great point about protecting our line judges. If we fail to protect them when the little stuff is happening, we are giving folks the idea that they can chirp and chip until we reach a limit. WRONG! We have to protect our crew from the get-go so that they can do their job without being influenced by the crowd or the bench.

The very first time that a coach is in the sub zone, give him/her the warning that they are to remain beyond the attack line. If the coach is in the sub zone again, they should be there for one of two things - to request a time-out or a substitution. If they are not there for those reasons, they had better have something that they need to discuss with the R2. It is usually not a Yellow Card because what they are doing is NOT unsporting. However, it can be considered as delaying the game thus an Unnecessary Delay time-out can and probably should be imposed. If they still continue to infringe on the sub zone, THEN you can start using the cards as needed. (Just an extra added step thrown in to teach the coach where they can and cannot be).

[TimTaylor]

I'll second what Andy & Jan said about the line judges. They're an important part of our crew. When I talk to them pre-game I make sure to tell them that, and also make it clear that if they get any flak from anyone I want to know about it immediately.

[Retrozetti]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

I'll second what Andy & Jan said about the line judges. They're an important part of our crew. When I talk to them pre-game I make sure to tell them that, and also make it clear that if they get any flak from anyone I want to know about it immediately.

I am very territorial about my Line Judges... not that I've ever had to "card" a player/coach... the verbal caution was sufficient every time. In my pre-match with my LJ's, I always include a quick discussion about handling coach/player comments, and I instruct them (especially in case they don't know the rules that protect them) that "no players/coaches are ever allowed to discuss, argue or influence your decisions, they are not supposed to converse with you at all. But matches get competitive and energy gets high, so they might try to argue a call. If they do, I give you permission to ignore them completely... just look straight up at me, because I'm probably already calling the captain over to put a stop to it. So, they're not supposed to talk to you, and you're actually supposed to ignore them and simply just look up at me. However, if you heard any comments directed to you that are bothering you, or especially are aggresive, threatening or inappropriate, tell me or the other ref immediately after the ball is dead."

I get so many LJ's that give a sigh of relief, and are actually surprised to learn how to handle those situations... they are truly unaware of "how to handle the situation." And funnier still (though not really funny), they usually start telling war stories of parents and coaches that have said some really horrible things to them.

Additionally, the BEST advice I've ever gotten was at a PAVO Line Judge clinic... and now, I "always" instruct my LJ's that if they need to report anything to me or the other referee, just walk down to the net, and act like they are straightening the antenna... that gives them a very discreet opportunity to inform the official. I like it !

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by Retrozetti

I am very territorial about my Line Judges... not that I've ever had to "card" a player/coach... the verbal caution was sufficient every time. In my pre-match with my LJ's, I always include a quick discussion about handling coach/player comments, and I instruct them (especially in case they don't know the rules that protect them) that "no players/coaches are ever allowed to discuss, argue or influence your decisions, they are not supposed to converse with you at all. But matches get competitive and energy gets high, so they might try to argue a call. If they do, I give you permission to ignore them completely... just look straight up at me, because I'm probably already calling the captain over to put a stop to it. So, they're not supposed to talk to you, and you're actually supposed to ignore them and simply just look up at me. However, if you heard any comments directed to you that are bothering you, or especially are aggresive, threatening or inappropriate, tell me or the other ref immediately after the ball is dead."

I get so many LJ's that give a sigh of relief, and are actually surprised to learn how to handle those situations... they are truly unaware of "how to handle the situation." And funnier still (though not really funny), they usually start telling war stories of parents and coaches that have said some really horrible things to them.

Additionally, the BEST advice I've ever gotten was at a PAVO Line Judge clinic... and now, I "always" instruct my LJ's that if they need to report anything to me or the other referee, just walk down to the net, and act like they are straightening the antenna... that gives them a very discreet opportunity to inform the official. I like it !

Some good tips - might just try to work some of it into my pre-match.....

I've never had to card a coach or player, but the only time I've had game management remove a spectator from a match was for a rude and profane comment I overheard them make to one of the line judges.