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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 01:21pm
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what happened here?

A video from the baseball board.

Watch play 5. NCAA game, 3 umpire crew, R1 on first.
What happened with the umpires coverage?

I see U3 chase the fly ball, PU halfway to third to pick up the lead runner, then U1 makes the call at the plate. Was this just a completely blown rotation/coverage?

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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 01:22pm
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What do you think is wrong with that rotation? It's textbook.

The only thing ACTUALLY wrong is PU is slightly in the runner's path.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 01:51pm
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In 3 man if a base umpire went out there is no rotation home. And yes, the plate umpire got in the path of the runner.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 03:02pm
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Maybe, just guessing here, PU went to 3B, then ready to go back home because he reverted to 2 man mechanics with U3 chasing. U1, meanwhile, rotated because he saw PU go to 3B and thought he had to cover home.


While you're at it, and I know it's a baseball play, but what do you have in the last play in the video (D3K) using softball rulesets?
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 03:51pm
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Quote:
While you're at it, and I know it's a baseball play, but what do you have in the last play in the video (D3K) using softball rulesets?
Looks to me like the catcher simply airmailed the ball into right field. Personally I have nothing on the play.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 04:58pm
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Originally Posted by SethPDX View Post
Maybe, just guessing here, PU went to 3B, then ready to go back home because he reverted to 2 man mechanics with U3 chasing. U1, meanwhile, rotated because he saw PU go to 3B and thought he had to cover home.


While you're at it, and I know it's a baseball play, but what do you have in the last play in the video (D3K) using softball rulesets?
That is the play that was the subject of the baseball board post.
I agree with RKB.....I got nothin'.

Evidently, in some baseball rulesets, this could be ruled as interference.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 06:38pm
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Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
What do you think is wrong with that rotation? It's textbook.
Actually from this year's CCA Manual (pages 102-103), the rotation was botched. When U3 chases, P has the runner at third and home, and U1 has first and second. Maybe they deviated and communicated.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 07:56pm
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Originally Posted by Jake26 View Post
Actually from this year's CCA Manual (pages 102-103), the rotation was botched. When U3 chases, P has the runner at third and home, and U1 has first and second. Maybe they deviated and communicated.
Nah.....I don't think there was deviation and communication here.
Unfortunately it was a botched rotation. It was a botched rotation in 2012 (date on the video) too as the Manual had coverage on that play then, the same as it is now.

PU got himself behind the 8 ball from the start of the play by not first moving to the holding area in front of the circle. That movement would have kept him out of the R1's way when she rounded third.

I agree with SethPDX's assessment as to why U1 rotated home. Good job on his part in covering the hole in the rotation.

We've all been part of, or responsible for, a botched 3 man rotation at one time or another. We kick ourselves (both individually or a crew) after the game and try to learn from it. I'm sure it was no different for this crew.

As a side topic....
Realizing that U1 had his hands full getting his tail down to home to make the call......does anyone have OBS on F2 at 0:39?

Last edited by KJUmp; Tue Aug 19, 2014 at 08:30pm.
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Old Tue Aug 19, 2014, 08:46pm
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Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
Looks to me like the catcher simply airmailed the ball into right field. Personally I have nothing on the play.
Nothing from me either.
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 08:11am
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I see no OBS at :39, runner was never hindered.
For that matter, runner was not hindered by PU either.
She's just looking for an excuse.

As for the baseball play, a case could be made for a running lane violation.
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 09:30am
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Originally Posted by Andy View Post
That is the play that was the subject of the baseball board post.
I agree with RKB.....I got nothin'.

Evidently, in some baseball rulesets, this could be ruled as (running lane) interference.
ONLY in the wonderful world of FED. All others require a "quality throw" before you can call interference.
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 11:03am
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Originally Posted by Jake26 View Post
Actually from this year's CCA Manual (pages 102-103), the rotation was botched. When U3 chases, P has the runner at third and home, and U1 has first and second. Maybe they deviated and communicated.
Honestly ... didn't see U3 chase on first watch. And he did that kind of halfway, which likely caused PU's confusion and U1's rotation. If you're going out, GO OUT! Looks like he sort of rotated, sort of chased, and got caught in between.
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 11:04am
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Originally Posted by PATRICK View Post
I see no OBS at :39, runner was never hindered.
For that matter, runner was not hindered by PU either.
She's just looking for an excuse.

As for the baseball play, a case could be made for a running lane violation.
As for the baseball play, it's pretty clear cut nothing in everything but FED, and nearly as clear cut interference in FED.
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 01:27pm
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U1 is still moving right up until the tag. Seems like with the late start he possibly should have stopped at 3BL extended? (Or gone inside?)
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Old Wed Aug 20, 2014, 03:30pm
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Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Honestly ... didn't see U3 chase on first watch. And he did that kind of halfway, which likely caused PU's confusion and U1's rotation. If you're going out, GO OUT! Looks like he sort of rotated, sort of chased, and got caught in between.
He did go out. He Paused, Read the play, and Reacted by chasing.
At 0:20 batter has made contact with the pitch.
At 0:22 U3 has pivoted w/back to infield and chasing into OF toward centerfield, then peels of to his right when he sees there's no catch.

U3 and U1 (in covering for PU) did their job. I'll say again, this rotation getting off the rails was the fault of the PU.
PU didn't read U3's chase and moved straight down the 3rd base line rather than initially moving to the holding area in front of the circle; and judging by what we see in the video, my guess is that he failed to communicate to U1 that the crew was now in two-man coverage.

Last edited by KJUmp; Wed Aug 20, 2014 at 03:34pm.
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