Batting Out of Order, Volume 2

[MD Longhorn]

Had a kid bring up a scenario at a clinic that I thought was rather interesting. The initial situation is similar to the one being used in the other thread, so I'll convert it to be more like that one.

Correct batting order is B1, B2, B3, B4, etc.

B2 bats first and singles.
B1 bats next and singles, B2 to third.
B3 takes a pitch and the defense appeals.

No one is ruled out by the umpire, as the pitch to B3 legitimizes B1's batting out of order and the proper batter (B2) is on base ... so B3 should be up to bat.

Coach orders his pitcher to commit an illegal pitch. B2 scores, B1 to 2nd, ball 2 on the batter.

Situation A: The defensive coach NOW appeals B3 batting out of order.
Situation B: The defensive coach waits for one more pitch to B3 and appeals.
Situation C: The OFFENSIVE coach sends in B2 to bat and assume the 2-0 count.

Rulings?

[Andy]

I'm missing something.....

Once the first pitch to B3 happens legitimizing B1's at bat, and since B2 should be the proper batter but is on base, B3 (who is at bat and has taken a pitch) is the proper batter.

Why does an illegal pitch change anything and allow any further BOO appeals?
So....

A and B - Appeal denied, the batting order is correct

C - I'm not allowing this, along the lines of not allowing an illegal substitution.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Andy

C - I'm not allowing this, along the lines of not allowing an illegal substitution.

And if you did without realizing it, B3 could be out if AB completed and properly appealed.

[MD Longhorn]

A&B - So... how is B3 the proper batter after B1 if B2 is no longer on base?

My answer to him was if A or B happened, the remedy is simply to put B2 into the batters box. And that C is REQUIRED, not just allowed, if the offense wants to avoid BOO.

Say B3 completes their at bat with a single... wasn't B3 out of order since B2 was the proper batter and was not on base when B3 hit the ball?

[RKBUmp]

B3 became the proper batter as B2 was on base and a pitch was thrown to B3. Dont see how B2 coming in to score could possibly reinstate a batting out of order situation.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

A&B - So... how is B3 the proper batter after B1 if B2 is no longer on base?

My answer to him was if A or B happened, the remedy is simply to put B2 into the batters box. And that C is REQUIRED, not just allowed, if the offense wants to avoid BOO.

Say B3 completes their at bat with a single... wasn't B3 out of order since B2 was the proper batter and was not on base when B3 hit the ball?

I'm going to disagree....we had the BOO appeal, we ruled on it, fixed it, game moves on from here. B3 is the proper batter. Since B3 is the proper batter, her status doesn't change as a result of the next pitch.

What if, instead of an illegal pitch, it was just a wild pitch that allowed B2 to score and B1 to advance? Does that change anything? I'm still not allowing another BOO appeal.

[vcblue]

If I am reading the OP correct we have nothing for all three of your situations after the 1st pitch legal or illegal to B3. Per ASA rule 7-2-4 you do not remove B2 from the base. That batter is simply skipped without penalty. B3 is the correct batter.

Think about it: Why would we penalize the offense when the defense missed the previous two BOOs?

[chapmaja]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Had a kid bring up a scenario at a clinic that I thought was rather interesting. The initial situation is similar to the one being used in the other thread, so I'll convert it to be more like that one.

Correct batting order is B1, B2, B3, B4, etc.

B2 bats first and singles.
B1 bats next and singles, B2 to third.
B3 takes a pitch and the defense appeals.

No one is ruled out by the umpire, as the pitch to B3 legitimizes B1's batting out of order and the proper batter (B2) is on base ... so B3 should be up to bat.

Coach orders his pitcher to commit an illegal pitch. B2 scores, B1 to 2nd, ball 2 on the batter.

Situation A: The defensive coach NOW appeals B3 batting out of order.
Situation B: The defensive coach waits for one more pitch to B3 and appeals.
Situation C: The OFFENSIVE coach sends in B2 to bat and assume the 2-0 count.

Rulings?

My ruling is that once the pitch was delivered to B3, she became the legalized improper batter under rule 7-1-2 Penalty 4.

"When an improper batter becomes a proper batter because no appeal is properly made as above. The next batter shall be the batter whose name follows that of such legalized improper batter. The instant an improper batter's actions are legalized, the batting order picks up with the name following the legalized improper batter.

Since B1's at bat was legalized when a pitch to B3 was thrown, and by rule B2 can't be required to leave the base to become the batter, B3 is the legalized batter by rule (7-1-2 Penalty 6).

As a result in A and B, the appeal is denied. In C, I am not allowing this because it is making a mockery of the game, and under 3-6-13c.

I would also consider penalizing the DC under 3-6-13c if it was clear that he was telling his pitcher to commit an illegal pitch intentionally, and warn the pitcher if the was intentionally committing an illegal pitch (Casebaook 6-2-1).