That's Interference!

[charliej47]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Saying F7 implies to me that it was no longer within the step & reach at the time of the impediment.

Please let the BU make the call alone next time.
I I were BU and wanted to talk, I would go to you.

During Pre-game - We agreed that I would pick up the lead runner after she left 2nd base.

[MD Longhorn]

Nothing wrong with PU making this call, although like basketball - this is your partner's primary, so I'd hesitate half a second before calling it, in case he saw it the other way around. Worst thing you can have here is him calling INT and you calling OBS. Sounds like OBS to me too - but you don't want a blarge.

Coach deciding to hold the runner should not have an iota of bearing in whether you send this runner home or not - coach's decision was made AFTER the obstruction and was based on where that runner was and where the ball was at the time he made that decision.

Would she have scored absent the OBS - that's ALL that should matter to you.

[charliej47]

The runner was protected to 3rd base. She would have made home and added another run to the books but the coach decided to hold her so they could play another inning.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by charliej47

The runner was protected to 3rd base. She would have made home and added another run to the books but the coach decided to hold her so they could play another inning.

So, you're going to aid and abet the coach attempting to extend the game? Aren't you participating in an illegal act?

(Besides, what possible good can come from extending a blowout JV game?)

[charliej47]

I try to enforce the rules as written as I understand them. The runner was protected to her at least her next base which was 3rd.

It she had tried home and there had been a close call, She would have been safe under my understanding.

The fact that the coach chose to hold her on 3rd was the coach's decision.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by charliej47

I try to enforce the rules as written as I understand them. The runner was protected to her at least her next base which was 3rd.

It she had tried home and there had been a close call, She would have been safe under my understanding.

The fact that the coach chose to hold her on 3rd was the coach's decision.

So suppose you judged she would have made it to home, and when you announce the award, the coach at third wants to keep her there. WWYD?

[EsqUmp]

Just give the runners the damn bases they would have reached IN YOUR JUDGMENT had there been no obstruction.

Here is some food for though. Every second an average runner is impeded she loses at least 20 feet running. So if this runner was delayed for 2 seconds, ask yourself if you had given her 40 feet, would she have scored.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by charliej47

I try to enforce the rules as written as I understand them. The runner was protected to her at least her next base which was 3rd.

It she had tried home and there had been a close call, She would have been safe under my understanding.

The fact that the coach chose to hold her on 3rd was the coach's decision.

Yuck.

Please review this rule. Your enforcement is not correct. An obstructed runner does NOT have to attempt to reach the awarded base in order to be awarded that base.

If you were my umpire, and I was a coach - I would have my first baseman bearhug every hitter that hit an apparent triple or homer, and continue to hold her in front of first base. You would award first... after all, she didn't even try for second, right?

[Andy]

Originally Posted by charliej47

I try to enforce the rules as written as I understand them. The runner was protected to her at least her next base which was 3rd.

It she had tried home and there had been a close call, She would have been safe under my understanding.

The fact that the coach chose to hold her on 3rd was the coach's decision.

With obstruction, don't wait until the play is over to determine the award. Start making that decision at the time of the obstruction and stick to it. If you and your partner determined at the time of the obstruction, the award was to be home, that is the award you should make a the end of the play.

Waiting until the end of the play could bring too many more factors into play.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Andy

With obstruction, don't wait until the play is over to determine the award. Start making that decision at the time of the obstruction and stick to it. If you and your partner determined at the time of the obstruction, the award was to be home, that is the award you should make a the end of the play.

Waiting until the end of the play could bring too many more factors into play.

Is there no such animal as post-obstruction evidence in softball?

Ground ball base hit to the outfield. BR is slightly hindered by F3 rounding first, and you immediately decide she probably wouldn't get second. But then F8 muffs the ball and it goes toward the fence. BR is thrown out at third on a close play. Are you going to rule her out since you probably wouldn't have even protected her to second, much less third?

[youngump]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Would she have scored absent the OBS - that's ALL that should matter to you.

This is an interesting point. If the coach has a large lead and is holding his runners to one base on everything and then a runner gets obstructed between 2nd and 3rd I don't think I'm going to award home on that. She got the base she would have absent the obstruction. I also sense that I won't get any argument since the coach wasn't really trying to score her.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by youngump

This is an interesting point. If the coach has a large lead and is holding his runners to one base on everything and then a runner gets obstructed between 2nd and 3rd I don't think I'm going to award home on that. She got the base she would have absent the obstruction. I also sense that I won't get any argument since the coach wasn't really trying to score her.

If the coach is holding his runners to avoid running up the score, and a ball is thrown out of play, are you going to alter your award?

I hope not. And you shouldn't here either.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

If the coach is holding his runners to avoid running up the score, and a ball is thrown out of play, are you going to alter your award?

I hope not. And you shouldn't here either.

No because the award is two bases there. The award for the obstruction is the base they would have reached absent the obstruction. Absent the obstruction she would have stood on third for a long time waiting for the ball to be thrown in. [see below]

So suppose you judged she would have made it to home, and when you announce the award, the coach at third wants to keep her there. WWYD?

Not happening runners have to take awarded bases. That said, off the top of my head I couldn't tell you what the penalty for that is. I'm thinking there's no rule that makes a runner out for failing to take an award (other than of first) so I guess I'll have to direct her to score and then eject her for making a mockery of the game? This part I'm not sure of.

For the obstruction comment, I was only half-serious, I don't think fast enough to do this on the field and wouldn't if I did. Just thought it was interesting that the rule assumes the runner is trying to advance as far as possible but that's not always the case.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by youngump

That said, off the top of my head I couldn't tell you what the penalty for that is. I'm thinking there's no rule that makes a runner out for failing to take an award (other than of first) so I guess I'll have to direct her to score and then eject her for making a mockery of the game? This part I'm not sure of.

Actually, you could invoke the forfeit rule (e.g., FED 4-3-1e) when a coach "willfully and persistently violates any one of the rules after being warned by the umpire." You tell the runner she has to advance home, and the base coach insists she stay at third base, then that coach is willfully violating a rule.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Coach deciding to hold the runner should not have an iota of bearing in whether you send this runner home or not - coach's decision was made AFTER the obstruction and was based on where that runner was and where the ball was at the time he made that decision.

But the coach made that decision after hearing 2 umpires call obstruction, too.