Help Needed

[Neilfish]

This happened today while working a 14U Babe Ruth Tourn.

I've been working 20yrs and have never seen this:

I'll start off the definition of a Base:

A BASE is one of four points which must be touched by a runner in order to score a run...

So according to this definition, Home Plate is a Base.

Before I go in the scenario - I am referring rule 7.08 (i) in the Babe Ruth rule book:
If a runner touches an unoccupied base and then thinks the ball was caught or is decoyed into returning to the base last touched, she may be put out running back to that base, but if she reaches safely she cannot be put out while in contact with that base.

Here is what took place, a runner at 3rd decides to steal home while the pitcher had her backed turned to home plate – runner reaches home safe without a throw. Here is where it gets good, for some reason the runner decided to return to 3rd base. She re-touched home plate and actually made it safely back to 3rd.
After making back safely, her coach instructs her to go into the dugout, so she leaves the base and enters the dugout.

My question – does rule 7.08 (i) apply in this case? Does touching all (4) bases satisfy completion of running all bases? Or would the runner be ruled out for leaving the playing field?

Our ruling ended up being, safe & run counts. Still not sure if that is the correct call.

Rule 7.08(i) also refers to running the bases in reverse order to confuse or make a travesty of the game - I do not feel this was the case, but I can see how this rule could have also come into play.

Thanks.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Neilfish

This happened today while working a 14U Babe Ruth Tourn.

I've been working 20yrs and have never seen this:

I'll start off the definition of a Base:

A BASE is one of four points which must be touched by a runner in order to score a run...

So according to this definition, Home Plate is a Base.

Before I go in the scenario - I am referring rule 7.08 (i) in the Babe Ruth rule book:
If a runner touches an unoccupied base and then thinks the ball was caught or is decoyed into returning to the base last touched, she may be put out running back to that base, but if she reaches safely she cannot be put out while in contact with that base.

Here is what took place, a runner at 3rd decides to steal home while the pitcher had her backed turned to home plate – runner reaches home safe without a throw. Here is where it gets good, for some reason the runner decided to return to 3rd base. She re-touched home plate and actually made it safely back to 3rd.
After making back safely, her coach instructs her to go into the dugout, so she leaves the base and enters the dugout.

My question – does rule 7.08 (i) apply in this case? Does touching all (4) bases satisfy completion of running all bases? Or would the runner be ruled out for leaving the playing field?

Our ruling ended up being, safe & run counts. Still not sure if that is the correct call.

Rule 7.08(i) also refers to running the bases in reverse order to confuse or make a travesty of the game - I do not feel this was the case, but I can see how this rule could have also come into play.

Thanks.

Does Babe Ruth have softball?

It sounds like a version of OBR that you are using. If so, the runner legally scored. The runner can't undo legally scoring.

Rita

[RKBUmp]

Any rule set I am aware of, if the runner has legally scored, they cannot unscore themselves. They could be guilty of interference if they retreat to 3rd and draw a throw allowing other runners to advance, but they cannot unscore themself.

[Neilfish]

Thanks - can I get where that is in the rule book? I've looked and can find where it says a score cannot be undone.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Neilfish

Thanks - can I get where that is in the rule book? I've looked and can find where it says a score cannot be undone.

There isn't anything. The best you have is 4.09a. A run scores when.

Rita

[Neilfish]

I hate to keep bringing this up, but I keep thinking of senerios that this situation could happen.

What if a runner misses 3rd base, crosses home. But the coach sees the runner misses 3rd, and tells the runner to come back.....

The correct way for a runner to do that, is to re-touch home and go back to 3rd.

Would the runner not be allowed to do that because they crossed home plate and if appealed can be called out?

[MD Longhorn]

Not only CAN they return to 3rd, but they must.

But again ... read "a run scores when".

[Neilfish]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Not only CAN they return to 3rd, but they must.

But again ... read "a run scores when".

I have read 4.09, but as an umpire I don't know why the player returned to 3rd, so how can you count the run if they decide to return.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Neilfish

I have read 4.09, but as an umpire I don't know why the player returned to 3rd, so how can you count the run if they decide to return.

Who is watching third? Someone should know if the runner touched third or not. If they returned to third because they DID miss third, they never scored legally. They have to touch all the bases to score legally.

You need to know if they touched the base.

Rita

[Neilfish]

I'm just thinking (since this is the first and only time) it will ever happen, some info should be added to the end of 4.09 & the definition of a score.

Something like, once a run legally scores - it cannot be un-done...