ASA Should Be Ashamed

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

When in Rome, dress as a Roman.

In NYS, we have one standard uniform for high school. Only two items have logos on them, the sweater and jacket. The only reason they even have logos is to prevent umpires from buying non-umpire look-a-likes from stores. Nothing else has a logo, that way umpires can use the same uniform for other sanctioned events that don't require a specific uniform.

What I can't understand is why every time I go to a Babe Ruth, Little League or any other game assigned through a local ASA association, all of the umpires are wearing ASA uniforms. That's leaving aside the fact that ASA is printed on everything from the guys socks to his ball bags. Umpires begin to look like bulletin boards rather than officials.

My hat is never going to contradict the rules I'm using.

Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform.

Absolutely agree with this - especially the last sentence - "Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform."

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Absolutely agree with this - especially the last sentence - "Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform."

Absolutely correct. Most umpires fail to recognize that when you have letters/patches on your shirt/hat/ball bag you could open yourself up to a wide range of issues. Steve, you and I have seen a lot of strange uniforms in our time "on the boarder." It was interesting that a coach once pointed out how my partner and I were dressed in plain uniforms.

What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing. For example, my area runs a regional college club tournament in the fall. This is their first experience with "college ball" (it is about one level below DIII). They play with NCAA rules with some modifications. The local guys have ASA and State HS hats, and I keep harping on not wearing logo'ed hats. They won't purchase them. Most wear a plain jacket, so the shirt really isn't an issue. But I have made numerous attempts to change the hats.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

...What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing...

I am a stickler about wearing the proper uniform (for myself... I have no position of authority over what anyone else wears).

I have logoed shirts and hats for ASA, MSF/ASA, AFA (now defunct here), NAFA, and USSSA. I have ASA-logoed ball bags, and both navy and black plain ball bags. I have plain navy hats and plain black hats. I have non-logoed powder blue with red, white, and blue stripes shirts, and powder blue with navy, blue and white stripes shirts. I have an ASA logoed jacket and a non-logoed jacket. I have so much umpire uniform crap I have my own closet for it (the wife kicked it out of our MBR closet).

My annoyance is not having to buy the proper uniform for the sanction, but the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason (our high schools went from red/white/blue power blue to navy/blue/white apparently to appease the college guys... phooey... they make more money that I do; let THEM buy the extra shirts!) And, during the sanctioning food fight here, AFA came and went and the invented NAFA took its place, leaving me with AFA stuff I'll never use again. And, while I'm bitching, lets not forget the MSF/ASA shirts; standard ASA wasn't allowed; it had to be the MSF/ASA shirt! More shirts I'll never use again.

[ASA/NYSSOBLUE]

Funny, my gripe here in NY is that we DON'T wear logos, not even on the hat! All we wear is plain hats and plain powder blue shirts. There have been prototype NYSSO hats floating around, but they do not want to go that route. We get told that the reason for this, is that for the people working way upstate (Watertown, Glens Falls, etc), it would be a burden, as they only work 10 or so games a year.

This is why, for example, it took them FOREVER to dump the ELBECOs - and that was only because ASA stopped selling them. Same thing with the gray/navy blue pants.

[xtremeump]

Originally Posted by ASA/NYSSOBLUE

Funny, my gripe here in NY is that we DON'T wear logos, not even on the hat! All we wear is plain hats and plain powder blue shirts. There have been prototype NYSSO hats floating around, but they do not want to go that route. We get told that the reason for this, is that for the people working way upstate (Watertown, Glens Falls, etc), it would be a burden, as they only work 10 or so games a year.

This is why, for example, it took them FOREVER to dump the ELBECOs - and that was only because ASA stopped selling them. Same thing with the gray/navy blue pants.

With Bruce and Kathy on your NYSSO Board, you are mistaken to say GF area, I do without even trying 200+ fast pitch games a year in that area. We go all Winter with the Dome, I agree that there are places that only do HS games. Not CDSUA.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Dakota

I am a stickler about wearing the proper uniform (for myself... I have no position of authority over what anyone else wears).

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason .

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

The latest is USSSA's 4th shirt vendor in 5 years and caps only 2 years old being obsolete.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

The latest is USSSA's 4th shirt vendor in 5 years and caps only 2 years old being obsolete.

Get ready. There are new NFHS-logoed umpire shirts for next year. And our state changed the logo that goes on the shirt, as well as came out with a newly-logoed hat (we wore plain hats before). So the state patches I have at home to iron on new shirts are obsolete now.

ASA has also come out with newly logoed hats and shirts.

There should be a wear-out period for old stuff in these organizations. When I was in the military, new uniform requirements would come out on occasion. We could continue to wear the old uniforms for 3-5 years to ease the burden of purchasing the new items, and to not screw the troops who just bought the old items without realizing new ones were coming out.

Amateur sports organizations should do the same thing. Don't screw umpires who just bought shirts and hats by making them have to wear the new stuff immediately. Allow a phase-out period so that it's acceptable to have crews with a mix of the old and new for a few seasons.

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

The latest is USSSA's 4th shirt vendor in 5 years and caps only 2 years old being obsolete.

And three different colors to boot!

[shagpal]

Wearing properly logo'ed uniforms is part of the cost of working. Umpiring is an avocation, not an occupation. The ASA is sandbagged with paycheck umpires, something that could easily be fixed if they made small adjustments to policy and enforcement.

Its those same paycheck umpires that have no business working college ball, and that is what the NCAA dictated years ago.

Originally Posted by Big Slick

Absolutely correct. Most umpires fail to recognize that when you have letters/patches on your shirt/hat/ball bag you could open yourself up to a wide range of issues. Steve, you and I have seen a lot of strange uniforms in our time "on the boarder." It was interesting that a coach once pointed out how my partner and I were dressed in plain uniforms.

What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing. For example, my area runs a regional college club tournament in the fall. This is their first experience with "college ball" (it is about one level below DIII). They play with NCAA rules with some modifications. The local guys have ASA and State HS hats, and I keep harping on not wearing logo'ed hats. They won't purchase them. Most wear a plain jacket, so the shirt really isn't an issue. But I have made numerous attempts to change the hats.

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by shagpal

Wearing properly logo'ed uniforms is part of the cost of working. Umpiring is an avocation, not an occupation. The ASA is sandbagged with paycheck umpires, something that could easily be fixed if they made small adjustments to policy and enforcement.

Its those same paycheck umpires that have no business working college ball, and that is what the NCAA dictated years ago.

You totally missed to point of my post. The two tournaments I referred to are not sanctioned by any organization (or ones that at least manufactures any uniforms). But umpires are still wearing logos because that's what the only hats/shirts they have purchased for umpiring.

We understand you have a burr in one of your orifices about ASA for some reason. We get it, we understand, move on with another argument. The ASA isn't the only organization that has umpires that are out to collect money. I believe you can find that in every organization. Politics exists in every organization as well.

And what exactly did the NCAA "dictate years ago"?

[shagpal]

No, I think YOU missed the point.

Its not just the ASA, its their sloppy umpires that wear the brand simply to garner the paychecks when they have no business doing so. If you let them get away with it, they do it, and they do.

Originally Posted by Big Slick

You totally missed to point of my post. The two tournaments I referred to are not sanctioned by any organization (or ones that at least manufactures any uniforms). But umpires are still wearing logos because that's what the only hats/shirts they have purchased for umpiring.

We understand you have a burr in one of your orifices about ASA for some reason. We get it, we understand, move on with another argument. The ASA isn't the only organization that has umpires that are out to collect money. I believe you can find that in every organization. Politics exists in every organization as well.

And what exactly did the NCAA "dictate years ago"?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

My theory is purely economics. ... The local guys have ASA and State HS hats, and I keep harping on not wearing logo'ed hats. They won't purchase them. Most wear a plain jacket, so the shirt really isn't an issue. But I have made numerous attempts to change the hats.

Really? You can get plain hats at Academy for $6. This can't be the reason.

Personally, I have TWO shirts and TWO hats with the ASA logo - and more than 10 shirts and at least 6 hats with no logo at all (and, of course, one TASO hat). I find myself more prepared for whatever may come along if I have unlogo'd gear handy.

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Really? You can get plain hats at Academy for $6. This can't be the reason.

Working with unlogo'ed hat is relatively new here. We had an abundance of ASA tournaments in the past, and high school ball. Therefore, that was the gear. So when this tournament came around, most couldn't/wouldn't lay out the necessary expense to get plain clothing.

Plus, I didn't say it was the only reason, just another reason. It is all systemic anyway, umpires that do care about not looking like a clown are those that put the time, effort and money into becoming better.

[shagpal]

I have yet to see an NCAA umpire wear NCAA or conference uniform, HS umpire wear NFHS or assoc uniform, USSSA umpire wear utrip uniform, or any other sanction umpire wear uniform out of sanction. BUT, I frequently see ASA umpires wearing ASA at non-ASA specific sanction events. I say its an ASA and ASA umpire problem, but you insist otherwise.

Originally Posted by Big Slick

Working with unlogo'ed hat is relatively new here. We had an abundance of ASA tournaments in the past, and high school ball. Therefore, that was the gear. So when this tournament came around, most couldn't/wouldn't lay out the necessary expense to get plain clothing.

Plus, I didn't say it was the only reason, just another reason. It is all systemic anyway, umpires that do care about not looking like a clown are those that put the time, effort and money into becoming better.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by shagpal

I have yet to see an NCAA umpire wear NCAA or conference uniform, HS umpire wear NFHS or assoc uniform, USSSA umpire wear utrip uniform, or any other sanction umpire wear uniform out of sanction. BUT, I frequently see ASA umpires wearing ASA at non-ASA specific sanction events. I say its an ASA and ASA umpire problem, but you insist otherwise.

For once I somewhat agree with you. I don't see NCAA gear worn elsewhere. I don't see USSSA worn elsewhere. I DO see, however, the TASO hat worn elsewhere --- usually by 1st year high school guys who think they are big-timing the others by showing up wearing it. Interestingly, by the 2nd year these same guys realize how stupid they looked and cut it out.

On the other hand, at least around here, it's severely frowned upon by assignors to allow people to wear the ASA hat at a non-ASA event... and if you try wearing one at a NFSA event, it's likely to get you booted for the entire weekend. That said, on the RARE occasion that someone wears something they are not supposed to, it's ASA gear. I suspect, at least in the cases of these rare individuals, that it's because ASA is the only organization training newbies - and the newbies are the ones that don't know any better until someone tells them.