ASA Should Be Ashamed

[EsqUmp]

When in Rome, dress as a Roman.

In NYS, we have one standard uniform for high school. Only two items have logos on them, the sweater and jacket. The only reason they even have logos is to prevent umpires from buying non-umpire look-a-likes from stores. Nothing else has a logo, that way umpires can use the same uniform for other sanctioned events that don't require a specific uniform.

What I can't understand is why every time I go to a Babe Ruth, Little League or any other game assigned through a local ASA association, all of the umpires are wearing ASA uniforms. That's leaving aside the fact that ASA is printed on everything from the guys socks to his ball bags. Umpires begin to look like bulletin boards rather than officials.

My hat is never going to contradict the rules I'm using.

Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Why would a Ford commercial run footage showing a Chevy win a race at Daytona?

Because they have so few of their own to run?

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

I didn't have a problem telling umpires working a PONY tournament to find another hat, shirt or ball bag that did not have ASA on it. I would not do it publicly or at the event I was observing, but afterwards at a local meeting or if I saw them.

It is a reasonable demand of any organization that values their brand.

It is, of course, their right to request / demand that their brand not be associated with another event. And, I never wore ASA-logoed gear when it was not an ASA-sanctioned game/tournament (referring to my post, above). I'm not arguing XYZ's right to object, just wondering about the wisdom of it as opposed to making hay from it. Would Chevy sue if Ford publicized their win at Daytona? Perhaps they would; maybe they shouldn't!

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

You ever umpire with someone you were almost embarrassed they were wearing the same uniform?

Yes, of course. But they were wearing the proper logos for the sanction!

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Ever have a discussion with a coach who insisted the ASA rule was this or that because the umpire had an ASA on his hat or shirt when in fact it was another organization, but YOU are the one who is wrong?

No. I have had coaches make similar arguments, but it had nothing to do with the umpire's hat, but rather the rule set being used at the tournament. And, I'm never wrong!

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Could go on all night, but I don't think you would bother reading

I always read what you write, Mike!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

No. I have had coaches make similar arguments, but it had nothing to do with the umpire's hat, but rather the rule set being used at the tournament. And, I'm never wrong!

A couple years ago, I was working a showcase under ASA sanction. The host organization played ASA travel ball, but their league was PONY sanctioned.

During ground rules, this coach started discussing rules about line-ups and subs, etc. that were PONY or local rule specific. My partner (PU) was becoming frustrated because no matter how many times he noted that wasn't an ASA rule, she just wouldn't shut up and kept rambling. Before he (and the other coach) blew a gasket, I told her, "Ma'am, that may be what your league or other rules allow, this is straight-out-of-the-book ASA rules today." Then she started on me with, "but in PONY..." and I stepped up, held up the ASA logo on my shirt and said, "ASA, not PONY" hoping the visual would get the point across. The opposing coach was pissed, but at the same time laughing wondering what type of coach cannot figure this out.

To my surprise, she stated that my shirt was the same shirt her league umpires wear! That did not make me a happy camper, but not so much they were wearing the uniform, but the information and rules being bantered about were not representative of the ASA game and all that can do is add to the confusion which the rest of us must deal with down the road.

And I doubt that confusion is just one way. Probably plenty of other umpires working non-ASA get tired of hearing what ASA does instead of that of the rule set under which the game in front of them is being played.

I always read what you write, Mike!

Why is it I have a feeling you are just stringing this along to boost your post count to make up for the time lost?

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

What I can't understand is why every time I go to a Babe Ruth, Little League or any other game assigned through a local ASA association, all of the umpires are wearing ASA uniforms.

Years ago, my local insisted on ASA caps, etc. for HS because we are an ASA association. I was often criticized for wearing plain uniforms as it clearly said in the HS rule book. We finally corrected that, but it might relate to the issue above; also possibly because of no other uniforms.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

...To my surprise, she stated that my shirt was the same shirt her league umpires wear! That did not make me a happy camper, but not so much they were wearing the uniform, but the information and rules being bantered about were not representative of the ASA game and all that can do is add to the confusion which the rest of us must deal with down the road.

Aw, heck, Mike, for years and years we were ASA-only for girls fastpitch in this state, but with all the state, league, and tournament rules added on / changed, you might not recognize it! Just a few: bat the roster, can play with 8 players with no out when the #9 slot rolls around, umpires have authority to eject fans, strict no-profanity rule against players, coaches, AND fans... We'd have coaches AND umpires that when it came time for championship play, neither had any clue how to manage a line up.

ASA sanction does not preserve the "purity" of the rules.

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Why is it I have a feeling you are just stringing this along to boost your post count to make up for the time lost?

Caught me!

[shagpal]

I keep saying, the ASA is an empty and spineless brand. Seems it wasn't always that way, but its image has been so diluted its generic, even shameful. How and who let it get that way?

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

When in Rome, dress as a Roman.

In NYS, we have one standard uniform for high school. Only two items have logos on them, the sweater and jacket. The only reason they even have logos is to prevent umpires from buying non-umpire look-a-likes from stores. Nothing else has a logo, that way umpires can use the same uniform for other sanctioned events that don't require a specific uniform.

What I can't understand is why every time I go to a Babe Ruth, Little League or any other game assigned through a local ASA association, all of the umpires are wearing ASA uniforms. That's leaving aside the fact that ASA is printed on everything from the guys socks to his ball bags. Umpires begin to look like bulletin boards rather than officials.

My hat is never going to contradict the rules I'm using.

Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform.

Absolutely agree with this - especially the last sentence - "Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform."

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by shagpal

I keep saying, the ASA is an empty and spineless brand. Seems it wasn't always that way, but its image has been so diluted its generic, even shameful. How and who let it get that way?

For as long as I've known anything about ASA and how they run their business, they have been quite clear that the local associations & leagues have a lot of latitude and that the complete "by the book" rules are for Championship Play.

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Absolutely agree with this - especially the last sentence - "Either wear the uniform of the rule set or wear a plain uniform."

Absolutely correct. Most umpires fail to recognize that when you have letters/patches on your shirt/hat/ball bag you could open yourself up to a wide range of issues. Steve, you and I have seen a lot of strange uniforms in our time "on the boarder." It was interesting that a coach once pointed out how my partner and I were dressed in plain uniforms.

What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing. For example, my area runs a regional college club tournament in the fall. This is their first experience with "college ball" (it is about one level below DIII). They play with NCAA rules with some modifications. The local guys have ASA and State HS hats, and I keep harping on not wearing logo'ed hats. They won't purchase them. Most wear a plain jacket, so the shirt really isn't an issue. But I have made numerous attempts to change the hats.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

...What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing...

I am a stickler about wearing the proper uniform (for myself... I have no position of authority over what anyone else wears).

I have logoed shirts and hats for ASA, MSF/ASA, AFA (now defunct here), NAFA, and USSSA. I have ASA-logoed ball bags, and both navy and black plain ball bags. I have plain navy hats and plain black hats. I have non-logoed powder blue with red, white, and blue stripes shirts, and powder blue with navy, blue and white stripes shirts. I have an ASA logoed jacket and a non-logoed jacket. I have so much umpire uniform crap I have my own closet for it (the wife kicked it out of our MBR closet).

My annoyance is not having to buy the proper uniform for the sanction, but the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason (our high schools went from red/white/blue power blue to navy/blue/white apparently to appease the college guys... phooey... they make more money that I do; let THEM buy the extra shirts!) And, during the sanctioning food fight here, AFA came and went and the invented NAFA took its place, leaving me with AFA stuff I'll never use again. And, while I'm bitching, lets not forget the MSF/ASA shirts; standard ASA wasn't allowed; it had to be the MSF/ASA shirt! More shirts I'll never use again.

[shagpal]

Its been explained that has been and is their position. I'm talking about protecting brand and image.

Originally Posted by Dakota

For as long as I've known anything about ASA and how they run their business, they have been quite clear that the local associations & leagues have a lot of latitude and that the complete "by the book" rules are for Championship Play.

[shagpal]

Wearing properly logo'ed uniforms is part of the cost of working. Umpiring is an avocation, not an occupation. The ASA is sandbagged with paycheck umpires, something that could easily be fixed if they made small adjustments to policy and enforcement.

Its those same paycheck umpires that have no business working college ball, and that is what the NCAA dictated years ago.

Originally Posted by Big Slick

Absolutely correct. Most umpires fail to recognize that when you have letters/patches on your shirt/hat/ball bag you could open yourself up to a wide range of issues. Steve, you and I have seen a lot of strange uniforms in our time "on the boarder." It was interesting that a coach once pointed out how my partner and I were dressed in plain uniforms.

What this thread has failed to addressed is the 'why?'. My theory is purely economics. Most won't spend the extra money on plain clothing. For example, my area runs a regional college club tournament in the fall. This is their first experience with "college ball" (it is about one level below DIII). They play with NCAA rules with some modifications. The local guys have ASA and State HS hats, and I keep harping on not wearing logo'ed hats. They won't purchase them. Most wear a plain jacket, so the shirt really isn't an issue. But I have made numerous attempts to change the hats.

[ASA/NYSSOBLUE]

Funny, my gripe here in NY is that we DON'T wear logos, not even on the hat! All we wear is plain hats and plain powder blue shirts. There have been prototype NYSSO hats floating around, but they do not want to go that route. We get told that the reason for this, is that for the people working way upstate (Watertown, Glens Falls, etc), it would be a burden, as they only work 10 or so games a year.

This is why, for example, it took them FOREVER to dump the ELBECOs - and that was only because ASA stopped selling them. Same thing with the gray/navy blue pants.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Dakota

I am a stickler about wearing the proper uniform (for myself... I have no position of authority over what anyone else wears).

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason .

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

My annoyance is ...snip ... the change for change sake stuff that just costs money for no good reason

The latest is USSSA's 4th shirt vendor in 5 years and caps only 2 years old being obsolete.